Godwin's Law, Ohio, guns, Obama and Hitler

Tom Jackson
Jan 24, 2013

 

Godwin's Law has come to the Buckeye state.
 
If you've never heard of Godwin's Law, you will need to know that it was formulated by Mike Godwin, an attorney and Internet freedom expert. It essentially states that as a political discussion on the Internet continues, the probability that someone will bring up Adolf Hitler approaches a near certainty.
 
Godwin's Law came to Ohio a few days ago when the president of the state school board, Debe Terhar, posted a photo of Adolf Hitler and commentary criticizing President Obama's gun control proposals. 
 
"She said her aim was to encourage historical reflection amid the gun-control debate, not to compare Obama to the Nazi leader," according to the AP's report on the case. 
 
Democrats have called the posting offensive.
 
Gun owners feel under siege, so naturally they are tempted to bring up the fact that Hitler disarmed the Jews.
 
Salon ran an article, "The Hitler gun control law," which accused gun buffs of distorting Hitler's record on gun control. But the article includes this amazing sentence: "The law did prohibit Jews and other persecuted classes from owning guns, but this should not be an indictment of gun control in general."
 
He only took away guns from the millions of people he murdered, so quit bringing it up, gun nuts! 
 
It surprises me Salon would publish this piece. There's more on this issue from the Libertarian Standard.
 
That said, bringing Hitler into the discussion seldom encourages constructive discussion. It probably doesn't "encourage historical reflection."  And in point of fact, Obama hasn't proposed disarming everyone, so it's a pretty terrible comparison. He's proposing certain restrictions, but his plan won't keep guns out of the hands of any adult who isn't a criminal or insane. That hardly constitutes disarmament.
 
The proposed ban on "assault weapons" seems unlikely to have much effect on gun deaths, by the way. (Here is a PolitiFact piece that grudgingly admits that rifles account for only a small number of gun deaths in America.) To really make a dent in gun deaths, the U.S. would have to massively reduce the number of guns in the U.S. I'm not clear on how to do that without becoming like a police state.
 
I'll probably post more on the gun issue, unless I come to my senses first.
 

Comments

The Big Dog's back

Now wait a minute. Is Obama a Socialist, Communist or a Nazi?

Contango

Marx and Engles use the terms socialism and communism interchangeably.

Il Duce spoke highly of FDR’s New Deal.

BHO is more of a corporatist.

Swamp Fox

I think the proper term is the president who follows the most extreme left wing liberal wacko agenda in our history.....

thinkagain

"Is Obama a Socialist, Communist or a Nazi?"

Yes

SamAdams

Nazis ARE socialists, Big Dog. Don't know what "Nazi" stands for, do you? And socialists are just communist-lite.

The word I heard for Obama today is "communitarian." That's pretty much a communist, but one who pretends he likes the neighbors, I guess.

Is Obama Hitler? No. Not even close. He's not Stalin or Mao, either. The point, though, is a valid one. Hitler, Stalin, and Mao weren't dictators from birth, after all. They just became so. And draconian gun control measures facilitated their agendas and their iron-clad grip on power.

I think what irritates me a lot more than people jumping the gun (pun intended) and heading right to the Hitler comparisons is those who absolutely refuse to learn from history's repeated lessons. Without exception, they say, "Well, but it will be DIFFERENT this time!" Uh huh. Sure. I'm betting the Jews in Germany thought the guy on the street who warned them, "This fella Hitler, there's something not quite right about him..." considered him their generation's Glenn Beck, too!

WiredMamba666

That last sentence is quite funny. So in that analogy today's gun owners are the Jews, the guy on the street is Glen Beck, and Glen Beck is Hitler? Or, gun owners are the "guy on the street", people who oppose gun violence are the Jews, and Glen Beck is Hitler?

The Big Dog's back

sam, sam sam, Nazis were/are Fascists. Authoritarians. Socialists are neither of those.

Randy_Marsh

FASCIST
noun
1.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.

2.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) the philosophy, principles, or methods of fascism.

3.
( initial capital letter ) a political movement that employs the principles and methods of fascism, especially the one established by Mussolini in Italy 1922–43.
Read number one and please explain to people how that is NOT like the present administration. Socialist perscribe to a economic standpoint, Your god likes to deal in domestic control.

BW1's picture
BW1

Authoritarians - exactly. It's all about control. Mussolini's fascist manifesto shares most of its tenets with Marx's teachings. Socialism is just fascism-lite, limiting its centralized, statist control to all things economic.

Recommended reading: Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg.

Contango

Re: "Liberal Fascism" by Jonah Goldberg.

Great book! Learned a lot about Pres. Wilson.

Fromthe419

Fascist = Central State, Central Planning. Just what we have right now, Fed pumping billions of dollars into the economy every month and artificially keeping interest rates low. Government picking winners and losers through bail outs and loans. When Ben Bernanke is Time Magazine's person of the year something is seriously wrong with our economy, a central banker? are you kidding me? I don't think Obama is a bad person, he'd probably be a decent neighbor, but I absolutely do not agree with his agenda. Ignoring the Constitution and doing end arounds by Executive Order are not going to bring this country together.

Contango

Dog writes:

"Nazis were/are Fascists. Authoritarians. Socialists are neither of those."

The Soviets weren't "authoritarians"? The N. Koreans aren't "authoritarians"?

How do socialists enact their confiscatory and onerous policies on the unwilling without the use of and/or the threat of force?

Swamp Fox

dog breath, NAZI were the National SOCIALIST Party who happened to also follow a fascist agenda....

Kimo

When it's all said and done, a lot will be said, little will be done.
.

richrs

National Socialist German Workers' Party.

Pterocarya frax...

Perhaps you and Sam should read up and refresh your memories about the Nazi party and Hitler.

BW1's picture
BW1

No need - they are both historically correct.

Mr Bean

Keep posting Mr Jackson, you certainly aren`t in any danger of "coming to your senses"

Mime Bloggling's picture
Mime Bloggling

Democratic Senator Diane Feinstein:

"There is no sunset on this bill. The purpose is to dry up the supply of these weapons overtime".

It's called incrementalism.

Naturally Liberal Democrats such as Mike Godwin would be offended with the Hitler comparisons. They bruise pretty easily it seems these days. But the historical fact is Hitler did disarm the Jews and then proceeded through law to exterminate them. With an intact 2nd Amendment we shouldn't fear that happening here...however the operative word is INTACT. Before Hitler was stopped he murdered over 50 million people. A history lesson that is mostly lost on the school kids of today. When the electorate sees a giant lurch to the Left in this country it gets a bit touchy about FREEDOM. What's the old saying...? "those who forget history are doomed to repeat it". Our system of government isn't "too big to fail". Thomas Jefferson: "Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty". That's about it for my "historical reflection".

"If the population of Eastern Europe were as well armed as the average American, the Nazis would have lost much of their military capacity attempting to implement the Holocaust." ~Clayton Cramer, Historian, Author

vicariouslyAlive

"He only took away guns from the millions of people he murdered, so quit bringing it up, gun nuts!"

who's to say that's not Obama's plan? i bet when Hitler took all of the guns away from hundreds of thousands of Jew's all of those people thought "there's no way he's going to kill all of us," and looking back on history he did just that. he made people defenseless before he attacked them, and if history has taught one single lesson that has always been true, it's been that history always repeats itself in some form. it might not be the mass murders that caused WW2, but there has to be other reasons to want to disarm millions of law abiding citizens.

void yourself of emotion for a minute, and entertain just the numbers here. there are roughly 270 million guns owned in the united states. that's 270,000,000 guns. there are about 55,000 gun related deaths (includes murder, suicide and accidental deaths). that means if each gun committed one murder, (which isn't always the case but i'm going to bloat the numbers in favor of the anti-gun people's favor here just to further stomp them out) that's a percentage of 0.02% that means 2 hundredths of a percent of guns are used to cause crimes. to help to represent this number a bit better to help those you of that cant comprehend how small this number is... 1% of $100 is $1. 0.02% of $100 is 2 pennies.

and like i said, some people use the same gun to kill multiple, so the percentage of deaths per gun is actually much lower than 0.02%.

the media works their magic, and guns become a big deal... just like plane crashes... thousands of planes take off and land each day, but when one of them crashes and burns, people refuse to fly out of fear... millions of guns exist in the united states alone, and when 1 person uses them inappropriately, people respond with irrational fear. statistically 1 out of 4 people own a gun. if you pass 100 people during your day, you've passed 25 gun owners, some of them were carrying them on their person when you passed them... so how dangerous are they really? how much do they effect your daily lives really?

oh, and some of those murders i accounted for above, were in the name of protecting one's house and family and officers killing criminals in the line of duty... i'd love to see the number of gun deaths if you were to take those wo factors out of the equation... i bet that number would get real small if you also took out the number of people that kill themselves with a gun instead of hanging themselves.. that percentage would shrink even further...

2cents

Actually the comparison between Obama and Hitler came up in these blogs long before the Connecticut situation.

Just saying!

Contango

@ Mr. Jackson:

Thanks for the link to The Libertarian Standard. I was unaware of this publication.

Regarding Hitler and guns:

IMO, the focus should perhaps be on how the Wehrmacht used gun registration to confiscate firearms and then execute "illegal" owners in Norway, Poland and other countries they invaded.

http://www.stephenhalbrook.com/r...

There's enough factual evidence without the need to resort to fantasy by either the left or the right.

-------------------

And yes, all the "isms" propagated by Hitler, Lenin, Mussolini, Mao, Chavez, Castro, et. al, stem from Marxism.

See: Ludwig von Mises' tome "Socialism."

Contango

"The NRA trained hundreds of thousands of Americans in rifle marksmanship during the war.

President Harry Truman wrote that NRA's firearms training programs 'materially aided our war effort' and that he hopped 'the splendid program which the National Rifle Association has followed during the past three-quarters of a century will be continued'.

By helping defeat the Nazi and Fascist terror regimes, the NRA helped end the Holocaust, slave labor, and the severest oppression."

"Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future." - George Orwell

http://www.stephenhalbrook.com/r...

KnuckleDragger

The Democrats of that era were cut from a different cloth than the socialists we have today. Todays Dems suffer from Delusions of Grandeur, a good portion of them probably shouldn't have access to firearms anyway since they suffer from a mental condition. LOL

Contango

@ KD:

An aside -

I was reading an article the other day about Pres. Eisenhower wanting to increase the debt limit in order to build the Interstate Highway System and Sen. Robt. Byrd being on the finance committee opposing him and wanting to cut spending.

Go figure!

The term "fiscal conservative Democrat" is an oxymoron. Joe Lieberman was about the last one and they kicked him outa the Party. :)

Pterocarya frax...

But you don't think Republicans have changed at all since the 40's-50's? Talk about delusional....

Contango

"Pterocarya fraxinifolia is a species of tree in the Juglandaceae family. It is commonly known as the Caucasian wingnut"

The Big Dog's back

What is your point?

Pterocarya frax...

Congratulations! You are today's winner. Answer 1 more question correctly, and I will buy your lunch.

What country was Barack Hussein Obama born in?

Contango

A quote I recently saw:

History must repeat itself, because we pay such little attention to it the first time.

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