Police: Dad charged with domestic violence for beating son

A Sandusky father beat his son with a belt Thursday after the boy got kicked out of school, a Sandusky police report said.
Sandusky Register Staff
Mar 17, 2012

A Sandusky father beat his son with a belt Thursday after the boy got kicked out of school, a Sandusky police report said.

Michael Miller, 32, was later charged with domestic violence.

The boy, 12, called 911 at about 11 a.m. and told police his father had just beat him up. Police arrived at the home in the 1600 block of Carr St. and located the boy, who had welts on his head, back and left arm, the report said.

“(The boy) advised his father ... arrived at the listed location in a gold four door car and told him to get in,” a report said. “(The boy) stated that Michael then took him to his girlfriend’s house and beat him up.”

The school principal sent the boy home Thursday for “disrespectful behavior,” the report said. The boy’s grandmother came to pick him up at school, but he ran off.

Comments

Professor Playdoh's picture
Professor Playdoh

Some people might think this was wrong.. The only thing I see is wrong was the kid was able to dial the phone.

 

OMGreally

I am actually with Professor on this...other then the welts to the head....when I was a kid I got beat with a belt several times..trust me you remember...

Super Judge
1 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 03/06/1992
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: CRB9200603
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DOM VIOLENCE
Case Type: Criminal 2 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 07/16/1992
Arr. Agency: N/A Case #: CVI9201913
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: PERSONAL LOAN
Case Type: Small Claims 3 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 11/13/1992
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: CRB9203917
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DIS CONDUCT
Case Type: Criminal 4 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 09/07/1993
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: CRB9303060
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DIS CONDUCT
Case Type: Criminal 5 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/11/1993
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TR9304576
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: PARKING TICK
Case Type: Traffic 6 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/30/1995
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: CRB9503810
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DOM VIOLENCE
Case Type: Criminal 7 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 02/01/1996
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: CRA9600373
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DOM VIOLENCE
Case Type: Criminal 8 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 04/10/1996
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: CRB9601103
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: TRESPASSING
Case Type: Criminal 9 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 09/05/1996
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: TRD9607001
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: RED LIGHT
Case Type: Traffic 10 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 09/11/1996
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: TRD9607191
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: SPEED 48/35
Case Type: Traffic 11 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 10/09/1996
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: TRD9608053
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: 50/35 SPEED
Case Type: Traffic 12 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 10/09/1996
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9608058
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: NO SEAT BELT
Case Type: Traffic 13 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 05/02/1997
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9703190
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: FTY RIGHT WAY
Case Type: Traffic 14 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 05/02/1997
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9703190B
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: NO SEAT BELT
Case Type: Traffic 15 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/04/1997
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: TRD9705825
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: LEFT OF CENTER
Case Type: Traffic 16 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/26/1997
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: TRD9706358A
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: VIOL O L REQ
Case Type: Traffic 17 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/26/1997
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9706358B
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: COMP W/POLICE
Case Type: Traffic 18 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/26/1997
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: TRD9706358C
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: VIOL TURN SIGN
Case Type: Traffic 19 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/26/1997
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: TRD9706358D
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: NO SEAT BELT
Case Type: Traffic 20 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 06/08/1998
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9803944
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: 50/35 SPEED
Case Type: Traffic 21 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/26/1998
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9806400
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: FAILURE/CONTROL
Case Type: Traffic 22 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 10/26/1998
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9807847A
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: RED LIGHT/SIGN
Case Type: Traffic 23 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 10/26/1998
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9807847B
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: NO SEAT BELT
Case Type: Traffic 24 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 09/07/1999
Arr. Agency: CP Case #: CRB9904236
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: INTOXICATION
Case Type: Criminal 25 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 12/06/1999
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9908669
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: STOP SIGN
Case Type: Traffic 1 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/01/2002
Arr. Agency: N/A Case #: CVF0201930
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: MONEY ONLY
Case Type: Civil 2 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 09/26/2003
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD0306145
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: UNSAFE VEHICLE
Case Type: Traffic 3 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 03/12/2004
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: TRD0401368
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: FAILURE CONTROL
Case Type: Traffic 4 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 03/17/2009
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: CRB0900880A
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: DISORDERLY COND
Case Type: Criminal 5 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 03/17/2009
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: CRB0900880B
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: OBSTRUCTING
Case Type: Criminal 6 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 03/17/2009
Arr. Agency: SPK Case #: CRB0900880C
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: INDUCING PANIC
Case Type: Criminal 7 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 08/18/2010
Arr. Agency: N/A Case #: CVF1001719
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: MONEY ONLY
Case Type: Civil 8 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 04/11/2011
Arr. Agency: SSPD Case #: CRB1100899
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: ASSAULT
Case Type: Criminal 9 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 05/12/2011
Arr. Agency: N/A Case #: CVG1100921
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: FORCIBLE ENTRY
Case Type: Civil 10 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 12/21/1992
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9207392A
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: NO OPER LIC
Case Type: Traffic 11 Concerning: Miller, Michael
D.B.A./A.K.A.:
Filed: 12/21/1992
Arr. Agency: SPD Case #: TRD9207392B
Docket Entry: Click
Charge: F DISPLAY PLATE
Case Type: Traffic

Father of the year.

althenaruby

Super Judge-  32 of those entries are for a Michael Miller DOB 10/11/1952.  The guy in this article is only 32.

I didnt see any charges for someone born in 1980 or 1979

Pragmatic
  If anyone has the insightfulness to read between these lines….I think people would see something different than the connotations made in the previous posts.  Grandma…picking him up from school after getting kicked out. This calls for a parent to be present. If no parent is present for that sort of issue…are they absent in everything else? Then, dad took the kid to his “girlfriend’s” house. Is he being raised by grandma, dad, mom, the girlfriend…??? Then, rather than try and figure out what’s going on…he beat’s his kid with a belt. There is a lot more going on here than just a disobedient 12 year old boy. Most likely - this isn't the first abusive behavior by the father.    Research for decades has indicated that hitting on a child (or spanking…whatever people call it) absolutely does not work as a discipline measure.  This research comes from psychology journals which provide real evidence (not the Parenting magazine you can buy off a magazine rack with opinions).  Even a  judge in a court of law doesn't assign this to someone who has murdered someone...they don't give out the punishment of:  beating with a belt!  That's because...it doesn't work.  We think it would...because it sounds logical.    Hitting a child makes the parents feel like they “did something” - - it's much harder to use our reasonsing skills than it is to allow our emotions to take over and use our hand or an object to get the message across.      Look, say what you want to (based on how you were raised…or your own values)…but, looking at this deeper and more intelligently…I don’t think this 12 year old had a chance to begin with. It doesn’t sound like he has had anyone to parent him. There is discipline…then, there is just plain ole’ assault. There is a difference even if people cannot conceptualize that. However, good parents start discipline at a much younger age….all the while finding balance between that - - and love. Frontloading my time into my child starting at 2 years of age (creating habits, molding behavior) worked wonderfully. It was time consuming, but worth it now that he’s almost a teenager. He knows what’s acceptable and what is not. I’ve never had to hit, spank, slap, beat, or assault him. Spanking is a preference in discipline. It isn’t illegal. But, just because it isn’t illegal doesn’t mean it works on the psyche of the kid to form better habits and to be self-motivated.      Being a parent (a good parent) is hard. We are supposed to influence our children…and entice them to follow our lead (and to even reach higher than we have). We are supposed to be leaders. I don’t think this 12 year old had much to follow. Maybe…it’s the parents who need the discipline.    
Warhol_89

I'm just going to say that beating with a belt to the point of leaving welts on a child is abuse. But spanking, absolutely not. I was spanked as a child and while I still make mistakes like everyone else, i've turned out to be a decent human being growing up. If I was raised on time-outs or anything like that, I probably would have never learned. And to this day I still don't understand why people consider spanking "abuse" or think it's cruel when parents do it to their kids in public... I just don't get it. The parents have to let their kids know who's the boss and teach them right from wrong. Just as comedian Steve McGrew said "So you put em' in time out. Why? So they can plan more evil sh** to do?", and it's no closer to the truth. Just as long as they let their kids know every once in awhile that they spank them because they love them, i'm more than sure the kids will be fine.

SimpleEnough

Pragmatic, Like my Neice, who likes to play everyone and then the drama she adds to the equation.

SaraMac

 Years ago, I disobeyed my Dad.He whipped my butt with a belt. I also called the police.The officer that came to our house, listened to my smart mouth for a few minutes.And promptly told me I deserved every swat I received. And yes, I was bruised too. 

SimpleEnough

SaraMac, Did it scar you for life or was it the beginning of an eye opener for ya about life?

SaraMac

@SimpleEnough- A real eye opener!! 

beatstreet

Allowing kids the right and ability to have parents arrested for disciplining them, ( inspite of the many other challenging dynamics with this family), destroys the ability to control one's own kids. We read far too many calls in the police blotter where the police are called to be parents. Most of them don't involve welts on the head, etc.

Police handling parenting matters is a lose-lose for everyone. The trend needs to be reversed. Good, bad, or otherwise, we cannot use the police to settle every dispute with defiant kids. Arrest and prosecution is not a one size fits all solution to family issues.

Professor Playdoh's picture
Professor Playdoh

If I was teaching today.. I’d be in jail.. These kids walk through the school with their pants down, flipping off teachers with no respect for anything. They get suspended over and over and sent home to play Xbox. All we do is train them that there are no consequences for their actions…  If you spank me I’ll call the cops… Paddles rule…

EZOB

Pragmatic;

              So this new trend in teaching and parenting, how is it working-out for you.  I sure haven't seen thing improve for the Teachers, Parents, and Certainly the Children.  Do Ya think just maybe, the old ways were better or do you really like the "Change"???????????

bullydogs1971

 Kudos to dad!  Too many kids need a askwoopin and most parents are afraid or dont care enough to do it.  Maybe we wouldnt have so many "hoodlums" runnin the streets.  My kids were spanked as soon as they knew what no meant,( probably about 1yrs old) by the time they were 7 or 8 they "got it".  They are respectful, intelligent, and loving teenagers now.  They show respect to their elders, excel in all they do and dont dare raise a voice to their mother.  Thank god for the paddle!  Im tired of this "warm fuzzy" society that just wants to give everybody a time out.  I got your time out......it time to go out and cut your own switch just like the old days boys and girls....kids need discipline not timeouts.  Who is afraid or cares about a time out.  When my assk was beat i listened.  A few bruise when we are young is alot better than the scars left by a generation of undisciplined kids that grow up to think they can do want they want to who ever and screw the consequences......bring back corporal punishment!

happycamper01

The child just learned that he does not have to obey his father, grandmother, or the school.  The kid will now threaten his father everytime he tries to discipline him.  I am willing to be that this kid did not call the police because he was severly hurt, scared of, or emotionally damaged but because he was pissed off at his dad because he was punished for getting kicked out of school and then ran off when his grandmother went to pick him up.  If his behavior was that bad at school do you really think he would have cared if his dad sent him to his room, grounded him, or took other privileges away?  Maybe he should not have used a belt but the kid was obviously out of control and needed some firm and harsh punishment.  Next time send him to the DH and tell the court to take custody so they can send him somewhere so that he can learn that the grass isn't always greener on the other side.  Youngstown Youth Academy, Boys Village, or his behavior can go unchecked and he can end up at Indian River or any other state run youth "prison." 

Professor Playdoh's picture
Professor Playdoh

To the Judge that will "try"  Mr. Miller..................

Thank Him.......

Shake his hand...

 

grandmasgirl

I agree with most of these posts. I like the comment "Frontloading my time into my child starting at 2 years of age (creating habits, molding behavior) worked wonderfully. It was time consuming, but worth it now that he’s almost a teenager. He knows what’s acceptable and what is not." All I have to say is, if he isn't a teenager yet, you don't know what kind of a child you have raised. He might just surprise you someday and you will find out that you are no different than any other parent who has tried and failed. I say "good for dad". Maybe he just got fed up with trying and being disrespected while all the time trying to put food in this worthless kid's mouth. And maybe after a little more discipline the child might turn out to be worth something after all.

KnuckleDragger

The kid should have gotten his rear beat. I see nothing wrong with what the father did.  Thank God we live in the country.  My kids know that it takes the Sheriff 25 min to respond out here, and they take that into consideration when thinking of calling 911.  If more kids got it with the belt, they would be a bit less disrespectful.  As for superjudge, you posted the record of the WRONG Michael Miller.  Nice try.

KnuckleDragger

@pragmatic says, "Research for decades has indicated that hitting on a child (or spanking…whatever people call it) absolutely does not work as a discipline measure."

This is old research, the newest research coming out is showing that they were wrong and that the research methods used to come to those conclusions were flawed. Even the American Academy of Pediatrics found the research against spanking only to be correlational and DOES NOT show causation, which means the jury is still out in their minds.

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/08/25/us/findings-give-some-support-to-advocates-of-spanking.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

 

http://humansciences.okstate.edu/facultystaff/Larzelere/

Researchers John Lyons, Rachel Anderson and David Larson of the National Institute of Healthcare Research recently conducted a systematic review of the research literature on corporal punishment.[6] They found that 83 percent of the 132 identified articles published in clinical and psychosocial journals were merely opinion-driven editorials, reviews or commentaries, devoid of new empirical findings. Moreover, most of the empirical studies were methodologically flawed by grouping the impact of abuse with spanking. The best studies demonstrated beneficial, not detrimental, effects of spanking in certain situations. Clearly, there is insufficient evidence to condemn parental spanking and adequate evidence to justify its proper use.

http://users.rcn.com/mgfree/Spanking/spankResearch.html

czechurself

In my opinion, everyone is right.  A combination of consequence and counsel is necessary.  Choosing one and not the other is lazy.   

I'll be willing to bet that the boy got the whooping for disrespecting grandma over anything else. 

lor70

If my kids were sent home from school for any kind of behavioral issue would've gotten a spanking!  I see nothing wrong with that, however, beating them with a belt until there were welts...that's a different story!  This is probably one of the reasons why the boy acts the way he does!!  How many times has this happened to him in the past?  There is a fine line between beating and discipline!

mamaC

the kid needs it again!  For calling the cops!!! Until kids stop thinking they have more rights then us parents this world will continue to go down hill. I am not saying beat your kids for no reason is alright. But when I was a kid if I came home with a detention I was scared and knew my butt was gonna get a spanking ... I turned out just fine! This generation is so screwed up with all these self intitled kids! 

Kimo

 

Will all the posters that think beating on people is the best way to prove a point, please stand.

No wonder this country is in the shape it's in.

 

November India Golf

yet meat beating is perfectly accepatable in today's schools

Publius

Hitler (head of the National German Workers Socialist Party - NAZI for short) created a police state using children to turn in their parents.  We all faced the belt as children, and I believe we are the better for it.  This boy is an example of how we are turning future men into... something else.  What kind of authority will this man have over his son now?  We relinquished raising our children over to the State.  This is the result, an inversion of values.  The kid now disciplines the father. 

Kottage Kat

Pragmatic,

 When I was growing up, getting disciplined by the hand to tush methold was very effective. My parents did not consult Dr. Spock (sp) on what do do when we needed to be corrected.

My father was not a user of the belt, and did not believe in it. At 6' 4 1/2" huis hands were big enough to get the message across. At barely 5" I did not try to outrun him. He was a gentle man, and very seldom had to use his hands on us. Mom was a diffrent story, she was chief of the "swatters"

With us it was a respect issue and that is the factor missing in the parenting equation in this day and age. My Mom may have raised a short fat kid, she did not raise a dumb one, and I was a fast learner. Not many offenses were repeated once I had been shown the error of my ways.  The fear of God and Mom sure influenced our behaviour.   Had I ben sent home ffrom school, I would have been wearing dentures before I was 13. 

I do not approve of the methold, I applaud the father for the discipline.         Kat

stepham2009

 I agree that the dad had EVERY right to discipline his son....I disciplined my kids when they were little with a belt when needed.....but to leave welts on his face etc was crossing the line....

Had Mr. Miller given his son a few good whacks to the backside I doubt anything would've been done to him.....

We ALL were disciplined with belts, switches (remember when mom or granny made you PICK your switch?) and their hands and we are all for the better.....I can honestly say my kids are not CRIMINALS, HAVE REPSECT FOR OTHERS, ARE NOT DRUG ADDICTS OR TEENAGE PARENTS and I credit that to DISCIPLINE and not just TIME OUT.....

Professor Playdoh's picture
Professor Playdoh

I wish I could explain to you about going to school in the 50s and 60s... Teachers were respected by the parents and the kids.. I can't imagine a student telling a teacher to “F off”  or whatever. …. The paddle or the fear of the paddle was a real deterrent not only to the paddled student but for the other 100 student that heard it, or heard about it. And heaven forbid what happen when you got home… I can’t think of anything worst than hearing your mom say..”Wait until your father gets home”.  And yes it was a better time.

Kottage Kat

Professor,  My fear of the discipline from a teacher, was not near as great as the fear that I had of what I would get when I got home. Teachers used to call the parents and advise them that the discipline had taken place and the reason. Parents were parents, NOT my friend. Respect for ones parents did not have to be earned, it was a given, because they were your parents. The lessons I learned then, are still with me today.

I graduated in 1966, my 4th grade teacher is still living, and when I see her it is Mrs.------, she has asked me to call her by her first name, just cannot do it, seems disrepectful. She is 96 years old and stil going strong. I respected her in 1957 and I do today. The same wirh all my former teachers. So sad that life and parenting have taken a turn for the worse, not ALL parents, those who just have not controlled their children and taught them to respect others.  Parenting is your JOB, and you need to do it. Not by beating your kids, discipline them and tell them it is being done to make them better and out of love. Be an example, and just maybe one or two might get the message.      Kat

WhatTheHeck

 Somebody should start a defense fund for this guy! Congratulations to Mr. Miller for having some old fashioned morals. And to all you free spirited liberals....you will be paying for the wrath of the over protected and unpunished youth of today for a very, very long time.

starryeyes83

We got the belt and or the switch when us kids were little.  Big whoop.. Gee none of us turned out to be druggies or criminals ...hmmm...go figure.

Warhol_89

I was just showing this article to one of my friends and even though i've been spanked when I was a kid, to my surprise he said he was given time outs instead of spankings. And he's honestly one of the nicest people you could ever meet. And through the many years i've known him, to my knowledge he's never done anything bad. I guess both methods of discipline can work when done right.

Good 2 B Me

This is EXACTLY what is WRONG in the world today.

The Dad Whoops the boy for being an A..Hole and gets chargeds throwns at him for it.

This is Ridiculous!

Ok, neighborhood kids...you should know what to do to this kid.

Blacktigress

Children are like cement, you must form it before it gets hard, after it cures the only way to form it is to chisel it.

The parents failed while the cement was formable, now their upset because they dont know what to do with this big huge concrete mass just laying around causing problems

 

Informed

Anyone who thinks hitting a child in the head is an acceptable form of parenting is out of their mind.  That is a textbook example of child abuse.  If someone did that to an adult, they would charged with assualt and sent to jail.  And to those who say getting paddled in school was a deterent, nothing could be further from the truth.  The tough kids who thought they were "bada$$es" would brag to see how many "whacks" they got.  And for the other kids, just the chance of getting reprimanded was deterent enough.  And yes, there were pleny of kids in the 50's and 60's who got into trouble--the only difference is they were sent to reform school, they weren't kept in regular school.

Anyone who knows anything about how people learn (all people), based on real empirical data, would understand that there are many much more effective ways to discipline a child than to beat them.  Obviously there are long-standing problems in this family, and it is the parents' responsibility to take action to find solutions to those problems.  You here are blaming the child for the problems brought on by his parents.  While this boy should still be held accoubtable for his actions, so should the father.  And for all you know, maybe the child hasn't learned anything differently.  Maybe he is treated like trash, thus is acting out.  Obviously this father is not father of the year if he hits his child in the head.

And for those of you who argue that lack of spanking is the reason for all of the problems with kids today, do you realize that the vast majority of people still spank?  So how do you explain that?  And please don't say that it's the kids who aren't spanked that are the cause of all the trouble.  Many kids who weren't spanked are well-behaved.  Not spanking does not mean kids aren't punished for bad behavior.  Most of the kids who are in trouble were spanked.  So please explain how that makes it effective.  Regardless, this isn't about a spanking.  This was about a beating.  Welts on his head?!!  Child abuse, no question about it.  Shame on all of you who think that this is okay!

 

 

Katelih-Trailer...

 I will not tell a person how to discipline their own child..But I certainly would not alllow MY son to be hit on the head with a hand , belt or any other weapon..I really feel that it is impossible to KNOCK SENSE INTO SOMEONE..or to KNOCK THE HELL OUT OF SOMEONE..

Apophis

Police were right to arrest the dad.  Now lets see if the judge does right and lets the dad off with only court costs.  I commend dad for doing something even if it was the wrong thing.  Parenting is not a perfect art. 

Blacktigress

Dicipline that doesn't hurt the parents worse than the child in my opinion is abuse.

There are several keys to raising a child, but there is only one MASTER KEY.

Love is the master key, 

With Love the parent and the child recieve time with one another. Very few parents actually spend time to develop a relationship of trust, authority, respect and concern. I would bet my last dollar that those who have unrully children did not spend time with their kids but they were raised in front of the tv, computor, the neighbors house, in my case it was a bar.

WIth time in the spirit of love the child develops a bonding of respect, this kid probably has little to respect his parents for so he's living for himself. A child who has learned the true love of a parent will shame themselves when they do wrong.

If you don't believe these points ask yourself this one question, WHy is it that most love or connect more with their mother than with their fathers?  Because they spend more time with them, they're around more when needed to hear their problems, etc etc. Sadly however, without the dad the child is only half raised and half complete.

Thankfully my children have a wonderful father who spends as much time as possible doing things with them and nurturing them. Yes, we disiplined but later found that if it was out of anger it was not discipline but retribution. Love does NOT SEAK REVENGE but is long suffering, kind, but it does not make excuses for bad or sinful behavior. 

Lastly, how is the punishment viewed by the child? If they think its you punishing them you have failed in educating them that they are responsible to God, Family and Society. Punishment lacking in any of the three is not punishment but self serving.

This thinking and belief has developed our children into proffessional people who have a real sence of responsibility towards God, Family and Society. Say what you want but my children, husband and self have never been arrested, we know where they are at night and we can trust each other without limits. Just beating a child turns them into something no less than a mean dog.

 

Kottage Kat

Black tigress.

When I was punished, and after the emotions settled down and cooler heads prevailed, the one who disciplined tried to explain the cause for the discipline and ususally it had the phrase, because you are loved and we want to teach you right from wrong. Not sure if that is done today, the explaination clarified, it taught, and often insured no repeats. Your comment was good and many could learn from that.  My father worked for the Dept. of Corrections, and he saw often time what can result from disrespect, and not eith being taught, or being disciplined.

Dad was the product of an abusive home, he was a wee bit more lax than  Mom, NO waiting till your father gets home, the problem was solved when the offense was committed.

Kids want and need discipline, they just don't know it. My generation gap is showing, and parenting today with all the external and internal forces is soooo difficult. To those who try, God Bless you. To those who need to try, get on it, and be parents. Where they go wrong? It is not for me to say. This their future, and parents job to insure that they know right from wrong, no respect for anything or anyone is a learned behaviour.   

NO is not a filthy word, and should be practiced often.

 

Blacktigress

Thanks Kottage Kat,

So true what you said about needing and wanting discipline.  I have a story that I could post but its too long and nobody would read it. It proves what you said is 100% correct.

Thanks for posting

 

Erie County Resident

My kids were "taught" by the school system to call 911 if anyone ever hit them.

So when my oldest got smart and was going to get a butt whacking told me to go ahead and I'll call the cops on you.

I then said your going to recieve your paddeling anyway, and IF you do call the cops afterwards they will have a reason to arrest me by the time they get here.

Amazing but no phone calls were made!!!

Blacktigress

@ Eric Co. Resident.

 

Ha ha ha!  I completely understand. 

Whats disturbing his the governement taking control of the family!  Its NOT THEIR KIDS! Besides, corporal punishment is legal, abuse however is not. I do believe the cops were justified in this arrest, this is beyond normal behavior for a parent.

 

 

Factitious

But not a very good solution. Paddling a kid is legal in Ohio, provided it doesn't go too far. Threatening illegal violence agaist anyone is illegal and thus abusive.

 

Factitious

I have to doubt the schools are telling kids to call the cops if their parents punish then by hitting them without injury.

Threating to call the cops due to lawful punishment deserve more punishment. Actually making the call? Even more.

Even if they doubted a crime had been committed, is there's any question as to whether the kid was actually injured, (whatever that means) the cops might feel they have little choice, because the issue of child abuse is so politically charged.

This kid probably doesn't realize he's executed a gambit, and if Dad is found innocent, he's in for more of the same.

But the worst part of the gambit is that unless Dad is really something special, this will probably do permanent damage to their relationship, and the system is more to blame than the kid.

We need more clarity on what is legally permissible punishment for kids.

We need to think harder about who should get the benefit of the doubt - the kid or the parent?

 

ProudPoppy

 Spanking, with or without a belt (not on the head, or anywhere but the behind) should be reserved for actions that might threaten harm to the child, or other people. My preference is to use one impliment consistantly. Then, all I need to do is get it into my hands, most of the time. MOST of the time. I, too, have been threatenned with a call to 911. And, I responded with the notion that it takes time for a response. Time I can use to finish the job, and make my jail time worth while. After which, any unruly behavior will be met with "Unruly Child" charges. When the child is confroted with "jail/juvenile detention time", his demeanor has a swift change. At least, mine do. I'm sure that there are some parents who's children aren't afraid of "time". If this is you, let them do the time.

CAST THE FIRST STONE

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained personal information. Discussion Guidelines

origen

Please dont hit your kids, Call the police and let them Taz them. Cuts out the middle man and the police will surely oblige. (Multitasking is fun!!)

lifetimeresident

Dads were lined up at Walmart today.  All buying them big ol 3 prong belts.  Spare the rod spoil the child.  Kudos to the Dad in this story.  You will probably get in trouble, but if your kid learned a lesson good for you.  You might of just saved his life in the future.

CAST THE FIRST STONE

glad you are not around my kids and hopefully you never had any..we never hit our kids and they turned out respectful and non violent..violence teaches violence i remember my dad hitting us . and i feel pity for him and never wanted to be like him

illuminoctis

i would be willing to bet that the same people who were on the other article commenting that it is OK to use a tazer on an unarmed 9 year old child for not going to school, will be the same people on THIS article arguing that welts on the head, arms, and back sounds "OK" to them... some will even praise it, i bet you

they will also probably be assuming all manner of things about the kid that are not (in any way) detailed in the article.. basically, making up things (assumptions) about the kid in public view of the rest of the commenters, showing their blind devotion to their ideologies (and reeking of collectivism)

Seen it All

There is NO way this child should of had welts on his head!!  I was brought up being punished with a belt, and I used it on my kids. I can see the upper leg, hand, lower arm if they are trying to get away or block it.. but NOT the head, probably why he went to jail!  I DO BELIEVE IN SPANKING YOUR KID!  If some of the brats out there got it, they would of learned at a young age to obey the rules and respect the parent, instead of what we see in our society now.  I spanked my kids, my sister opted out, my kids went to college, her kids went to jail.

Katelih-Trailer...

 Seen it all...Maybe you just gave more hugs,guidance and support to your kids than your nieces/nephews received. It may or may not have been ABOUT the belt whippings.

Liberal4TheBetter

 Ok before you start commenting that the dad was right to do this, what if you were the kid? We all were kids once. My dad wasn't abusive but, I knew kids that did have abusive parents. Do you always need to punish a kid by beating them? No, you can ground them, say the kid was in middle school, kids that age like to hang with their friends or play video games. So before you start saying the dad was right, #THINK!

Liberal4TheBetter

 @Pragmatic

I completely agree with you, you are one of the only people on here who knows what they're talking about. Yes spanking a kid is effective when they are 5, but a 12 year old will not care but to call the cops. Grounding is way more effective 

Blacktigress

Again, a child is wet cement and if you raise them correctly from the time the 'cement' arrives it takes a form that YOU want and not those on TV pumping filth, lack of morals, humor in being smart mouthed, pro death abortionists that excuse a loose and inmoral lifestyle and mock EVERYTHING that is good and pure, such as being chase before marriage.  If YOU form the concrete with love and TIME then there won't be the need for any major concern ,except for a slight surface reconditioning.

Parents, BE PARENTS and love your kids and spend time with them and SHOW them how to live. YOUR THE PARENT, if you don't love them give them tos someone who will! The shame isn't giving away a child you don't love or don't want to spend time with, the shame is saying your a parent while in fact your selfish.

 

 

Liberal4TheBetter

 

 @ Professor Playdoh

Really you act like your all that, (If I was a teacher today, I'd Be In Jail)

Ok first off, you are way older than the kids, If you were a teacher you wouldn't do anything. Where is it your place to do anything to the kids? You would give them a detention and that would be that. You act like your cool, on here posting like you know whats going on! You probably don't even know thing one about how their family is, and I don't know either. Maybe he was already abused!

Liberal4TheBetter

 I love our society these days. People on the Sandusky Register are so ignorant!

patriot5
Yep, for years the psychologists and liberals tell us not to spank our kids. The world will become rainbows and sparkling glitter. Be your kid’s best friend, your kid is your equal, and they will mind you and become upstanding pillars of society. I look around and don’t see it.   Too bad these types cant differentiate a child abuser that beats the crap out of kids each day, from the parent trying to teach kids right from wrong. These kids today know they can do as they please and call 911. I got the belt, most of my friends got the belt, we miraculously overcame that very dramatic emotional trauma called a spanking; surprised we are not emotionally devastated, scared for eternity, or morph into child abusers like the “parental experts” would have you believe.   When I attended schools, teachers most certainly disciplined the kids. I remember a teacher grabbed this jokester by the hair with one hand, dragged his desk with the other, and through them both in the hall. No cops came, are you kidding, they spanked kids also.   Problem is total lack of discipline in general; parents just don’t structure or discipline the kids, belt or no belt. No respect for anyone. I was out of town had to use a laundry facility, two kids about 11 years of age were destroying the place, parents right there; attendant tells parent kids cant do this, parents get angry!! I was going to buy the kids a coke and some cheesy puffs, “say destroy the place some more and I will buy you a new playstation game”. That’s the new improved liberal punishment and parenting methodology.   I was always explained what I did wrong, given a chance to rectify my situation. If that failed it was belt time, same with my kids. If this kid had done something like punch the teacher, eveyone would be posting " He needs a butt-beating" " Why didnt his parents discipline him"    
Liberal4TheBetter

@ patriot 5

Ok obviously it was directed at me so, I will reply. Ok now we got an conservative on our hands. Lets go back to the times when african americans had no rights, lets go back to the times when women had no rights, lets go back to the times when teachers could beat the kids. Obviously there is something else to this story. You weren't there, you don't know the details and it is a fact (which your party doesn't understand) that kids that are loved and treated better are more useful in society than those unloved. Just because your conservative father spanked you, doesn't mean anything. Times have changed. Conservatives are the past!

KnuckleDragger

@Liberal4thebetter (LOL, that's an oxymoron),  so you are equating spanking a child with not loving them?  Boy, are you ever screwed up.  There are two things I've noticed from your posts 1) You are obviously very young (probably a teenager) and know little about child rearing, 2) It is painfully obvious  that you do not have any children.  The last person anybody will take advice from is someone who doesn't have children.  If you take a look at the people who did the research that advocated against spanking, it's easy to find that most of them didn't even have children.  Like I said before, current research is not only showing, the so called experts against spanking were not only wrong, but their so called research was nothing more than personal opinion and showed no causation.  You are right about one thing, TIMES HAVE CHANGED, and not for the better, thanks to rabid libs such as yourself.

chongo

I can remember growing up, if we acted up when at the grandparents, our grandma would hand us the knife and tell us to go out and cut our own switch..  and don't come back with a small one, because you get that one, and then she will go get one and do it again.    guess what, we didn't screw around w/ or at grandmas..  lesson learned.    As an adult today, i see no problem there at all..  and one day as a parent, I WILL diciplin my child.   If someone has a problem with that, tough.   No one, No shrink, No Gov't, No person will tell me how to raise my child.  End of story.  It's time to keep all these busy bodies out of our every day lives...  Worry about your own stuff, I'll worry about mine..   end of story.

Liberal4TheBetter

 Chongo, I won't tell you how to raise your kid I will just tell you the facts and this story is a great example. Assumptions are all these comments are he is obviously from a broken home. Something in his past has led up to this we don't know what though.

big_d

 I can still remember swim time during gym at good old Sandusky HS in the mid seventies. Last one out of the pool got a crack with a swim board. Now they were not as hard as wood, but against wet skin could sting quite a bit. After a few days of that, guys would start edging toward the side of the pool in order not to be the last one out, but Mr Schweinfurth had a solution for that, put everyone in the middle and blow the whistle and watch everybody make a mad dash to get out. Todays helicopter parents and their precious snowflakes would scream bloody murder at this. My dad thought it was pretty funny.

gilamonster
My father spanked me too, are you saying I wasn’t loved. Get your liberal head out of your—s. I thank him for it, especially looking at these idiot monsters today! I see and echo your point that kids need to be loved, thats the smartest thing you have posted! Kids lack that today, parents dont want to parent their kids. Getting a spanking did not make me less loved nor have I become a less useful member to society than some kid that was able to do as they pleased. Just as Pat5 pointed out you liberals cant tell the difference between a child abuser and a good old spanking. I also agree that times have changed, for the worse. Oh I would have been so much more loved and productive had “daddy” dressed me in tie dye with Jesus sandals as we all sat around the commune, or let me run the streets on my own.   Teachers spanked kids, you more than likely got it again when you went home. No one sought litigation against the schools. Psychological nonsense! Not sure how all the past generations made it without liberals telling us what is best. IKH!
Liberal4TheBetter

 Its aparent all of us liberals have given up the hope to change all of you mindless retards to see the real world. You conservative a** backward people always like to argue with facts. I didn't mean to say that your parents didn't love you as much but as to give you less respect, or less attention. Sometimes you might be right,  but if you start teaching kids at a younger age to respect people instead of beating them everytime they do something wrong. THEY ARE KIDS THEY MAKE MISTAKES! In this case he was from a broken home and instead of beating him in the moment his dad should have taught him from his younger childhood to be respectful. Really, its not the kid its the parent.

lifetimeresident

@gilamonster

Have to agree.  Most of our parents loved us, just wanted us to be respectful.  Not a 11 year old flipping off cars as they go by.  Respect starts at home.  It's up to the parents.  No ones talking ABUSE.  Lets look around at our society today.  See what happened when the belt dissappeared.

Bfrank

The belt will not kill the young man but I bet from this point on he will think before he acts.  Has anyone considered how much the government is running our lives?  Just look at Communism!!!  Better that Mr. Miller whipped him in love because if he were in jail or  prison,  he could be be beaten daily by somebody who does not care or love him 

Seen it All

@ katelih.. Perhaps!  It's not like I had to whip my kids daily, weekly, or even monthly for that matter. Maybe 3 in a lifetime was enough!  I just know by the time they were teenagers, I did NOT get the profanity out of their mouths as I witnessed from my neices and nephews.  I don't think ANY parent should whip their child if they are too angry to control themselves.  There is a big difference between discipline and beating. I know I had 3 good whippings in my childhood.  The first one taught me not to lie... The second one not to mouth back.. and the third taught me that I have to follow the rules, whether they be rules my parents gave me, or society.  It worked!! 

gilamonster
Ok, I agree we should never assume anything. I had assumed this young man had been kicked out of school after receiving a gold star in academic excellency and a blue ribbon for exemplary behavior. Fearing that his father would reward him with a snow cone, he took off. His father wanted to beat the good grades out of him…lol   Why are we bringing up broken homes? Liberals have stated children thrive in broken homes. They say the traditional family is antiquated and old fashion.  Yep things changed; for the WORSE. Didn’t get the belt a lot, but when I did the message was “don’t do that again”

Kids today do things I would never thought to do, being disrespectful is the worse though.  

wiredmama222

hurrah to those who know to spank their children and send the message that for every wrong thing there is a consequence.  Time outs do not work.  Hurrah also for those who undestand that these kids being taught that calling the police on your folks for disciplining you is the equivilent of asking the Hilter regime to rise again.

For once parents of this country are seeming to come out of the fog and into the light and getting it right again. 

Do you think those kids that beat up the man on Ging St had the right discipline?  Do you think anyone in their families cared to take the time to show them right from wrong?  How many of you have spent time in a classroom of late and have seen the disrespect that goes on there?  I bet not many.  But a teacher is not allowed to TOUCH a child.  They get away with way too much. 

Nope, the father may have gone a little too far with hitting in the head, that I don't agree with, but on his butt was the perfect place.  And to disrespect his grandmother by hot-footing it out of there when she went to get him was just another form of disrespect which I bet he caught it for. 

Good job, Dad.  At least you are trying to do the right thing....and nuts to these stupid laws where a kid can call the cops and get a free pass if they don't like what Mom and Dad say or do. 

Lets get these loop hole laws closed and pronto. The government shouldn't be telling anyone how to raise a child. They can't even handle our money.

sanduskysteve

wiredmama - although I applaud you for your statements in the first part of your post about congrats to the parents today who whip their kids and don't let them be disrespectful and show them what respect means - and then you go an mess it all up with your comment "Good job, Dad." towards the end of that.

Good job?  I am all for spanking kids on the butt when they misbehave.  No doubt I was spanked a few times in my life growing up and with a nice wide belt to boot.

My issue is that the officer seen welps on the boy's head, back, and arms.  This is not longer considered disilpline in my book.  The belt use is fine, but on the buttocks.  Everyone was up in arms about the Texas judge who was beating his daughter with a belt on the legs and back - why is this soo much different.

There are proper places to spank a kid, the face, head, and arms are not those places.

Other than that, I say spank the bad kids and we will reap the results of more respectful kids running aroun dthe city.  Absolutely, I agree with spanking, if done properly and without rage being involved.

Liberal4TheBetter

 I agree SanduskySteve and Informed:)

SamAdams

The problem isn't with spanking kids, even with a belt. The problem is NOT spanking kids who need it!

"Welts?" Really? All that means is he had red marks. Big deal. You can get red marks from a decent spanking, too, with only the use of an open hand. My mother's "weapon" of choice was a wooden spoon. As I recall, she broke more than one giving me spankings I sorely needed!

Time outs DO work. Unfortunately, they tend to work for only the most sensitive and/or rational of children. When I was little, I was neither. Give me a time out, and I'll do just as one poster suggested some kids would do: Plot my revenge.

The boy in this story has learned a very important lesson from his spanking: Call the cops, and DADDY gets in trouble. He'll probably not be spanked again because Daddy doesn't want to go to jail, pay fines, be forced into "touchy feely" counseling, or whatever. And this willful and obviously very disrespectful little boy will soon become a willful and very disrespectful man. Just what we need more of in Sandusky!

Congrats to all of you politically correct and oh, so bleeding heart liberals. The problems we see in schools today and the problems we see on our streets today are a direct result of children NOT getting spankings and/or other significant consequences for their inappropriate actions.

Kottage Kat

Sam Adams,

 LIKE      

 

Kat

The Big Dog's back

 I see those of you on the right had trouble with following rules when you were young, just as you do now that you are older. Surprise surprise.

gilamonster
Spanking your kid is cruel; brought to you by the late term pro-abortion movement.   Corporal punishment is animal like; brought to you by those who claim we came from apes   If the kid dies from punishment, would that not be Darwinian natural selection?   Violence begets violence; my kid loved toy trains but he’s not a railway employee.   Save your kid, beat a liberal! IKH- I Kick Hippies! Whenever I hear some self-righteous freaks proclamation and how great their ideologies are, I want to puke.   Man, you said retard, that’s not liberal-like!! Wow a hypocrite! Not nice to say that. Liberals recite evidence that non-traditional broken homes play no part in a childs behaivor
Kimo

 

Re:Really, its not the kid its the parent

Like

The only thing the old man taught the kid is that if you don't like what someone does or says, it's ok to beat on them.

It's no wonder this country is so screwed up we have all these people that had their brains beat out voting.

so sad.....

 

Kimo

 

Re:Whenever I hear some self-righteous freaks proclamation and how great their ideologies are, I want to puke.

Maybe you should look in a mirror.

My ideologies are better than your ideologies, wanna fight?

 

gilamonster
Ok self righteous freak, your idea is better than mine   I dont try to push my ideas down others throats.
patriot5

Speaking of freaks….. A few of you need to look in your own mirror. Wanna fight? LOL

I love this rag, best entertainment all day

Thats the only thing Kimo could pick out of that rambling, the rest  their  post must be true. Hahaha

wiredmama222

@Kimo......so since you are puking right now, I suggest that you try ice chips instead of drinking anything.  It will settle your stomach.   And don't look in any more mirrors for at least the next few hours. 

wiredmama222

Yeah, Big Dog, but at least we are all out of the basement now. 

BW1's picture
BW1

Erie County Resident : My kids were "taught" by the school system to call 911 if anyone ever hit them. So when my oldest got smart and was going to get a butt whacking told me to go ahead and I'll call the cops on you. I then said your going to recieve your paddeling anyway, and IF you do call the cops afterwards they will have a reason to arrest me by the time they get here.

There's a better response a friend of mine used on her kids when rhey made that threat :  "Go ahead and call - see how you like foster care. If you think you've got it bad now, you haven't seen anything yet.  Here, I'll dial the phone for you."  The kids never tried that again.

wiredmama222

EXCELLENT response. 

BW1's picture
BW1

SamAdams :. My mother's "weapon" of choice was a wooden spoon.

Three words:  Hot Wheels track.
 

wiredmama222

OUCH.......

My dad.....his hand, our butts

after that, the yard stick over the plastic footstool and a yell that would melt metal to stop or we would get spanked. we stopped. 

BW1's picture
BW1

wiredmama222 : EXCELLENT response.

Mom always said parenting was more like poker than chess:)

BW1's picture
BW1

wiredmama222 : Time outs do not work.
 
You're mostly right on that, with one notable exception.  They work for SOME kids - passive, compliant kids with very little imagination.  That's why there are always some parents who can claim success without spanking.   A time out would NEVER have been a meaningful punishment for me - it would just be another opportunity for imaginative daydreaming.  Punishment has to suck, or it's not punishment.  For some kids, the combination of physical pain and loss of autonomy that spanking represents is the only practical way to create the desired effect.

The other one that makes me laugh is when a parent says they punish their kid by taking away TV.  If your kid is effectively punished by TV deprivation, all that proves is that TV is WAY too important to your child.  If taking away any innecessary frills constitutes meaningful punishment, that's a signal you're raising your child to be too high-maintenance and you better hope and pray they never encounter any adversity in life.
 

BW1's picture
BW1

...

The Big Dog's back

 Man, I must have been the perfect kid who turned into the perfect adult.

Liberal4TheBetter

 I thought I was alone on this, seems like these conservative wacko's  were born and raised wacko's. They always want to fight against the way society should be.  

Liberal4TheBetter

If it weren't for the right our society would be way better off. Always fighting for more money when a great portion of our society are homeless. TAKE TAKE TAKE, NEVER GIVE  

patriot5
Do you know those types want to make a simple paddling a crime? My eldest son came in for St Pats, as we are mostly Irish. He was Reading some of this and laughing his rump off. Time out and simple yelling worked with my other son, but not this one, he is like me. He has no children, so I asked, “ Son was I ever abusive to you, disrespectful, or not give you enough quality time?” He is rolling on the floor laughing! By these “parental experts” he should be traumatized and a non-productive member of society. Must be why he went to the service, then RIT, and now has a good career of his own. I never paddled the kids just for sake of paddling them, nor did my dad. My son is still laughing, ask me if I remember throwing his computer out the window, or removing parts from his motocross bike, thats another story. Dog, some day I hope to achieve your level of total perfection, life must be good.

  

wiredmama222

Sending a child to his room today for a time out punishment:  

Little johnny goes to his room for punishment.  There is his $3,000 computer which is hooked up to the internet, TV which is hooked up to Satellite or cable and his 100+ channels.  His cell phone is laying on his desk next to his land ipad, loaded with 300 or so music downloads.  On his bed is his brand new Kindle that Grandma and Granpa got him for Christmas.  Ah, yes.  He is to THINK about all the bad things he just did. 

Which to do first, decisions,decisions. 

Yep, that works REAL well this time out thing now days. 

LOL

lifetimeresident

Who brought up that Hot Wheels Track.  The Orange one that you put together with the red pennie roll looking things.  Now a whack with that settled ya down.

illuminoctis

#1 i just want to make sure i am not being lumped in with liberals.. there are glaring differences between Libertarians and Liberals.. and when i say Libertarian, i do not necessarily mean the official party as i am still reading up on them to learn all of their positions on issues... (we agree on many things, but our solutions are very different.. Liberal solutions tend to seek infringement on the liberty of others in order to "fix things".. but Libertarian solutions do not infringe on the liberty of others... Libertarians are the champions of civil rights in both theory and practice... with Liberals, it tends to only be in theory)

#2 @Liberal4TheBetter ---> you should educate yourself about the history of racism and slavery before you start lumping "Conservatives" in with all of that

firstly, the country was originally founded on Libertarian principles (though they did not use the term Libertarian back then, i do not believe.. however, the Constitution is purely Libertarian, and vice versa)

granted, the modern-day Republican party is not a shining example of the founders and of the original vision of the Republic of these United States of America (not by any means, not at all, whatsoever), either

HOWEVER, that does not excuse the Democratic National Party for the sole starring role it played in slavery and racism throughout history

just ask the Supreme Court of the United States of America about the previous lawsuit and the current lawsuit (case # c11-1503) that is going on right now, which seeks to force the Democratic National Party to publicly acknowledge and apologize for their party, in regards to how the DNC had been the guiding force in slavery and racism in our country (a thoroughly documented fact that is not widely reported, and i am assuming is not clarified whatsoever in the school textbooks)

the previous lawsuit was won and they had to admit it in the court proceedings.. HOWEVER, the judge ruled that they did not have to issue a public apology since the plaintiff was not directly affected (ridiculous reasoning there).. but this new current lawsuit has a plaintiff who was directly affected

--->>> P.S. i do not go around spamming about this at all.. but i am not gonna sit idly by while you blatantly ignore these documented facts (or perhaps you were not aware, which is entirely likely)

MYthoughtsexactly

I do believe it is ok to spank your child if they do something to deserve that form of discipline. I do not agree they should be hit in the head with a belt, however.  I was spanked plenty of times as a child. I learned each time I was spanked that my actions were unacceptable.  Never once did I think or believe that my parents did not love me or care about me.  I made a bad decision and bad decisions have consequences. I deserved it for sure.  I was spanked with a belt, a hand, kitchen utensils... it taught me that what I was doing was wrong and not to do it again. I never felt "abused"... I felt like I was being corrected and that I would have to make better decisions to not be "corrected" again.  I turned out to be a pretty productive citizen so I don't believe spanking is bad.  I do not agree with abuse but I also don't feel spanking is abuse.  Let me say that I have some friends who were never disciplined when we were growing up and unfortunately they are the ones who are still getting in trouble and breaking the law. The problem is that people make excuses for kids who break the rules and they think they can get away with whatever they want to do. Its time we make these kids accountable for their actions and let them know their behavior is unacceptable by disciplining them (and I do not mean abusing them, as there IS a difference).

Kimo

 

Re:The last person anybody will take advice from is someone who doesn't have children

The ability to fertilize an egg, does not make an expert on raising children.

ur comments bounce all over the place, u a shill for the SR?

 

Liberal4TheBetter

 Kimo 

It is hillarious these people huh?

Liberal4TheBetter

 :0

Liberal4TheBetter

 Anyways this started out being a talk about a cop-killer! In NO WAY was he right to do this. Do you think Officer Dunn would want us arguing about this? Its not about being Right or Left its about what this man Randelman did!

dravenslair

sugar, I believe you are on the wrong story.

Katelih-Trailer...

I believe so, too. HeeHee

Liberal4TheBetter

 :0 i got confused ty

snatchblock_445

My mom  raised 4 of us, we got our a** whooped....and not one of us ever ended up in prison, why?...because we didn't fear the police or going to jail, we feared our mother, and i'm glad why? because out of my mom's brothers and sisters she was the only one that had 4 kids, the rest had one....my cousins have been in and out of prison..in fact one is there now, and the other one is not far behind him. They are in their late 30's and early 40's...they were always babied when they were kids and still are, they got whatever they wanted and were never taught how to stay out of trouble, or respect someone, so if whooping your kid's a** is what its going to take to get them to mind then so be it.

Katelih-Trailer...

 I remember as a little kid..I asked my parents if my brother and I could walk to the store..My Dad said, Yeah, and don't come back." I went outside and told my brother that we were allowed to go and we didn't have to come back !! He were both sooo excited.. We made big big plans. Guess what ? When our parents went looking for us and found us..we got whoopings...Not bad whoopings, though, just with some nasty old, USED fly swatter. My Dad did the swatting, while my Mom watched. I think they were wrong for that. Parents need to be very clear with what  they say to kids. Punishments need to be very clear, as well. I remember being very confused that day..Also, I lost some respect for my Dad and lost more respect for my Mom...On the PLUS side..I felt sooo close to my Brother..It was "me and him", against the whole wide world ! :)

Kottage Kat

To the person who said "if you don't have children"  I do not have children. I will not tell you how to raise your children. Fair enough? I do know how I was raised, and I was spanked and like the person with the Grandma who let you pick your "switch", learned to get the right size the first time out to choose.

My Mom was not only a good disciplinarian, she was creative. She knew her children, and after all elase failed, she would make us do everyone's chores for a week as punishment, that was a sure cure especially in the summer when we wanted to be outside, not hauling treash, doing dishes, and other household chores. " while my siblings got to go out and play. Torture for us. "Time out" was for Mom to get away from us.  

There were rules, and they did not change. I was in my 30's and had to stay with Mom and Dad due to a surgery. First thing Dad said " The rules haven't changed, and if you have forgotten any, I will refresh your memory" It was pure and simply respect. Children only learn what they are taught, and sometimes it takes corporal (sp) punishment to get the message across. NOT ABUSE, when the line is crossed then intervention by an outside agency.

My Mom never worried about us even thinking about calling anyone, we knew we had done wrong and that consequences would be forthcoming. I feel very sorry for the children who never know the teachings of a parent, to respect yourself and others. To have self esteem, because you are taught to be productive and have the satisfaction of knowing through some tough lessons right from wrong.

My prayers are for a nation that is going to be led by the products of parenting today, with the help of our government. May God have Mercy on us.

FruGalSpender

next time take a hair brush to the brat's bare buttocks.

bluedot

Spanking is one thing but beating a child with a belt and leaving welps on his head, back and arms is a little brutal on all levels. I'm just saying the kid is 12 with obvious behavior problems makes you wonder where the problems stem from....

wiredmama222

that cartoon reminds me of a song I heard as a little girl: 

"When my mother says come in its time to eat,

And I keep on playing games out in the street ,

I resolve now to come home when I am told.

Cause my dad just bought a hairbrush and he's bald !

LOL

Informed

Mythoughtsexactly, if you had to be spanked plenty of times as a child, obviously spaking wasn't effective.

Not spanking does not mean not disclplining.  And time-outs are not an end all and be all of effective parenting.  They are one tool in a bag of about a thousand that can and should be used.  The problem is most people neither understand their purpose nor use them correctly. 

Prisons, drug treatment centers, welfare rolls are all full of people who were spanked and/or beaten.  They also have people that were neither.  However, the vast number of people use corporal punishment still to this day, but try to blame societal problems on the lack of spanking.  This makes absolutely no sense.

It is never acceptable, even for those who spank, to hit a child in the head. Most children with behavioral problems that are not the fault of a severe disability (autism, for instance) have them because of ineffective parenting or other problems in the home.  Parents with children as young as three years of age try to blame the child's behavior on the child instead of acknowledging their role in the child's actions.  It makes me sick.

I am sure this was not the first time this boy has been hit.  If hitting works, then why did this boy get in trouble at school in the first place?  It doesn't take a rocket scientist or brain surgeon to realize there are serious problems in this family.

Kimo

The first study to look at methamphetamine's potential lasting effects on children whose mothers used it in pregnancy finds these kids at higher risk for behavior problems than other children.

The behavior differences — anxiety, depression, moodiness — weren't huge, but lead researcher Linda LaGasse called them "very worrisome."

Methamphetamine is a stimulant like crack cocaine, and earlier research showed meth babies have similarities to so-called "crack babies" — smaller in size and prone to drowsiness and stress. Results in long-term studies conflict on whether children of cocaine-using mothers have lasting behavior problems.

You can beat on these kids, till the cows come home, it don't the problem......

 

Kottage Kat

I was a head strong, do it my way child. Got my share of "spankings", perhaps to teach that bad choices result in consequences. I did not lack for discipline, and it came in a variety of forms. The punishment usually fit the crime.

Those paddles with the read rubber ball attached were the pits. I feel that children need to learn the reason they are being disciplined, and TAUGHT right from wrong, NOT taught that abuse is an acceptable form of discipline. Correction done properly and within reason should be the rule, not the exception. Too often the inmates run the asylum, and the parents lose control out of fear, once control and respect are established, perhaps a balance can be reached. Children have to know who is in control and reapect that. Parents need to use wisdom,love and not fear in discipling their children.

Oh, I am a still head strong, and do it my way. Just learned moderation.          Kat