Ohio: Vote is crucial - but who are your voters?

Tommie Jo Marsilio is a former union shop steward. She's a single mom. And she's a Mitt Romney voter.
Associated Press
Oct 30, 2012

 

"It's not my job to shatter stereotypes," she says. But she is. Two years ago she became the first Republican elected to the local county commission as part of a Republican wave in an Ohio county that Barack Obama won in 2008.

From the candidates' campaign headquarters in Boston and Chicago, the electorate looks like a series of demographic groups. Voters become bar charts — women and union members for Obama, men and retirees for Romney, all part of the metrics to measure turnout and make educated guesses about outcome. But on the ground in this battleground of battleground states, with early voting well under way, the reality can complicate the science and generalization.

In a race this close, how well Romney and the president target their voters, sway independent ones and get them to the Ohio polls might well determine the outcome of next Tuesday's election. But people often don't match the voter profiles.

Take John Petelin, a 43-year-old skilled tradesman, a white male who voted for a third-party candidate instead of Obama in 2008.

He might be expected to line up behind Romney. But he isn't.

"I'm an autoworker," Petelin said outside the Lorain County Board of Elections building where he had just voted for Obama. "It's been tough out there. And Romney wanted to kill us. I can't go for that."

Or Kris Donofrio, a mother with three children in college. Standing by her car after voting in Lorain, a north-central Ohio city west of Cleveland, she scoffs at Romney's suggestion that kids can borrow for school from their parents.

But her parents, staunch Democrats she said, are voting for Romney. "They're concerned about Medicare," she said. "They think Obamacare is not for them."

Ohio voters like these are steadily making their way into county polling places across the state, casting early ballots that will determine whether Ohio will serve as a Democratic firewall against Romney's advance or a fire pit where the president's candidacy will perish.

Across the country, about 15 million voters already have cast ballots in the presidential contest, according to the United States Elections Project at George Mason University. In Ohio, about a million have submitted absentee ballots or voted in person.

With just a week left before Election Day, Obama holds some clear edges in Ohio, not the least of which is an advantage in the early vote and a robust get-out-the-vote organization. He holds a narrow lead in some public polls in the state, though others show a neck-and-neck race as the campaign tightens in the homestretch.

Obama's political outreach, built on the broad base of support from 2008, is extensive and frequent. The auto industry, boosted by the government bailout, is resurgent.

In an interview with Cincinnati radio station WIZF that aired on Monday, Obama laid out the early vote strategy.

"We really want to bank as many votes as possible," he said. "So the fewer people who haven't voted yet, the better our Election Day operation is going to be."

But Romney, energized and locked in a dead heat nationally with the president, is mounting his own aggressive voter contact effort, partly counting on the inroads Republicans made in the state in 2010 and seeking to capitalize on discontent toward Obama among many independent voters. In county after county, campaign aides say, more Republicans are taking steps to vote early than did in 2008.

In Ohio so far, Democrats have a 31 percent to 24 percent lead among voters who have cast ballots in 50 of the state's 88 counties, according to data collected by The Associated Press. Forty-five percent of early voters in those counties were unaffiliated.

Those numbers have limitations. Party affiliation is based on the last primary in which someone voted, so new voters and those who don't vote in primaries are listed as unaffiliated.

A poll by Time magazine last week had Obama's advantage over Romney among early voters at 60-30 across the state.

And internal Republican polls also show Obama with leads even in Republican-leaning parts of the state, increasing the burden on Romney to do well on Election Day.

"We have seen a slight Democratic advantage in key districts in early and absentee votes," said Wes Anderson, a Republican pollster who has conducted surveys in congressional races in Ohio. "Those who have yet to vote are clearly trending Romney's way. The question is, is this movement toward Romney happening fast enough and big enough to overcome the slight deficit that he now has in early voting."

Romney advisers say they see signs that outside the big, populous counties, Romney could benefit from a wave of conservative voters as President George W. Bush did in 2004.

"Rural counties are really coming home," Romney political director Rich Beeson said. "You see it in early absentee and you see it in the intensity level. That's where we're going to make some ground."

Obama aides say the early turnout in Ohio is higher in counties that voted for him in 2008 than it is in precincts that voted for Republican John McCain that year.

Yet, a number of counties where Obama won four years ago, including Hamilton County in the Cincinnati suburbs, Stark County south of Cleveland and Portage County where Kent State University is located and where Marsilio is a commissioner, voted for Republican Gov. John Kasich and Republican U.S. Sen. Rob Portman in 2010.

Besides Ohio, the eight other battlegrounds where the candidates are spending time and money are Colorado, Florida, Iowa, Nevada, North Carolina, New Hampshire, Virginia and Wisconsin.

So far, Democratic voters casting early ballots outnumber Republicans in Ohio, Florida, Iowa, North Carolina and Nevada. Republican voters have the edge in Colorado. No votes will be counted until Nov. 6, but several battleground states report the party affiliation of people who have already cast ballots. Some, like Ohio, have large blocs of unaffiliated voters.

In North Carolina, more than 1.5 million people have cast ballots, 50 percent of them Democrats and 31 percent Republicans. In Iowa, about 471,000 people have already voted — 45 percent Democrats and 32 percent Republicans. About 433,000 voters in Nevada have cast ballots, 45 percent Democrats and 37 percent Republicans.

In Florida, about 1.8 million voters have cast ballots and Democrats have edged in front of Republicans, 42 percent to 41 percent, according to a tally by the AP. Republicans had the early lead among people who voted by mail, but the Obama campaign has made a big push since in-person early voting started Saturday.

About 804,000 voters have cast ballots in Colorado, and Republicans have a slight edge over Democrats, 39 percent to 36 percent.

 

Comments

Contango

Regarding the Benghazi "terrorist attack":

"State Department security officials replaced the American military team in Tripoli with trained Libyan bodyguards, while it also maintained the number of State Department security personnel members at the Benghazi compound around the minimum recommended level."

Wonder if Mr. Obama would recommend replacing his Secret Service protection with Libyan bodyguards?

Lefties: It's from the NY Times, so it's safe to read:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/3...

---------------------------------------------------------------------

The "official" story after seven weeks, is now that Mr. Obama is indignant that anyone would 'dare' question him:

“But I do take offense with some suggestion that in any way, we haven’t tried to make sure that the American people knew as the information was coming in what we believed.”

http://www.realclearpolitics.com...

2cents's picture
2cents

Our president is incompetent and showed his lack of skill and decision making skills in Libya. There was no teleprompter to tell him what to do. The real puppet showed his true color!

the office cat

It's unfortunate you don't know how the system works. Responsibility for guarding embassies/compounds is the host country - just as we guard all foreign placements here. I think maybe the government doesn't release information and reports for two reasons: 1) security and 2) folks like you who read only the reports they choose to read so they can post slanted opinions to try to rouse the rabble.

KnuckleDragger

@officecat, you forgot #3 so I will post it for you. 3)because it may cause embarrassment to the administration in an election year where the Presidential race is a dead heat. There, now the list is complete :)

John Harville

@knuckle... you forgot #4} So John McCain will have something to distract him and turn a 'non-political' rally into a 'get the President' rally while 38 people are dead from the most dreadful storm since 1821.

Contango

@ the office cat:

I don't particularly care what you "think."

As an American, other than a seven week stonewall, I want to know what our President "knows."

John Harville

@Contango.. by what right? Do you also want to know the strategy for defending other embassies? Why don't we just post it on FB or Twitter so all our enemies can know what the President/government know so that our enemies will know how to attack even more? What IS your need to know except to 'get' the president - who, by the way, is being VERY Presidential .

mikel

it's his job to be presidential.

sanduskysteve

It is also his job to protect national security - and I'm sorry - but that doesn't mean he has to release everything involving security to you or anyone else that is not in a "need to know" situation. How about you complain because the Military Leaders aren't holding a person conference with you before they do anything at the pentagon as well? You guys really need to get off this crap - and if this is the only thing you have to argue against Obama about - you really should stop supporting Romney because the arguments against him are hundreds more. Of course we don't dare mention any, because instead of arguing against that - you will just turn it back around to Lybia again because that's really all you have. The anti-Obama door has been closed - it's really no use. Romney lies every time he opens his mouth and all you have is Lybia. How about you try to make a valid argument FOR Romney/Ryan - probably because you really can't.
As for the "very very old" teleprompter argument. Stop - it's way beneath even a republican at this point. Every President used a teleprompter and I don't know if you are aware of it or not - but your FOX reporters all have teleprompters below the cameras as well. Of course, they actually write the information which is placed on those - pretty much the same as anyone else using a teleprompter.

Darwin's choice

He's a "post turtle".......

OMG.LOL.WT_

I thought Clinton and Biden were magnificent last night in Youngstown.

Darwin's choice
Contango

An adulterer and and a man with dementia impressed you?

OMG.LOL.WT_

Character assassination. Shame, Shame.

OMG.LOL.WT_

Character assassination. Shame, Shame.

Contango

@ OMG.LOL.WT_:

They're "characters" all right.

So Mr. Clinton never had affairs or had to pay restitution for alleged rapes?

And Mr. Biden isn’t 70 yrs. old and hasn't displayed numerous memory lapses and gaffs?

And yes, I lived for one yr. in Y-town, worked in Sharon, PA and was VERY glad to get out.

the office cat

Contango... and Mr. Romney isn't 65 years old and had his wife - on national television - express her concern for what this campaign is doing to his mental health? And Nancy Reagan did NOT prompt her husband on answers because (for those of us who have worked with it know) he was in early stage dementia the last three years of his campaign - which he later admitted?
President Clinton: he was acquitted by the Senate. And you'd best present the court orders where he paid restitution for alleged rapes - key word 'alleged' (as opposed to 'forcible' or 'intelligent')

mikel

puttytat - money makes many things go away!! just ask bill or hillary.

the office cat

@Mikelputty... or Cheney or Bush?
Or Rmoney?

KnuckleDragger

There is no court order in the case of a settlement. When parties agree to settle, the case is dismissed with prejudice.

John Harville

Ah. So you have nothing to post as proof? Actually, the Court has to record the final record of agreement before dismissing the case. So, you're saying when a couple gets a dissolution there is no record of the agreement? Put up or .........

mikel

see contango's post below.

Contango

@ the office cat:

Better see Paula Jones ($850K) and Juanita Broaddrick for two.

He also lost his law license for lying under oath.

Strange that you have no problem with his known infidelity.

John Harville

@Contango. No more than I have a problem with your alleged infidelities. And I say that completely without malice toward an entity who has chosen 'public figure' status.

John Harville

@ Contango. But if there's no record in a 'settlement' (Knuckle) how do you know the amounts. Post the record or blah blah blah.

Kimo

Re:"But her parents, staunch Democrats she said, are voting for Romney." "They're concerned about Medicare," she said. "They think Obamacare is not for them."

Romney wants to "voucher" Medicare.

Turn Medicare into a voucher system. That means seniors would no longer have the guarantee of Medicare.

These two old farts (my age) think this is a good thing.........

If it wasn't so sad, it would be funny.

KnuckleDragger

Why would "old farts" like you worry? If you've read the plan then you know anyone over 50 will see no change at all. Anyone under 50 will be offered a choice of traditional Medicare, a voucher, or be able to enroll in the same plan that Congress is currently enrolled in. How many times does the Romney campaign have to say this before you get it through your thick skulls? Oh, that's right, the MSM won't completely cover the plan, just the voucher part. The plan also provides for more a more generous subsidy for lower income seniors and a decreased subsidy for the wealthy. If you make over a certain amount, there will be no subsidy, regardless of whether you paid in. So the rich will not benefit from the medicare program. It would be funny, if Democrats weren't so blind.

the office cat

@Knuckle. 'old farts' like us have children under 50 who will be faced with the voucher decision.
'old farts' like us have been dealing with the infamous 'donut hole' provided by the Republicans in the unfunded 'Medicare Advantage' that forced us to get 'supplemental' insurance for medicines.
So why would 'old farts' like us expect a 'young smell' like Ryan - whose only contact with entitlements was his father's SS benefit on which he went to college when he easily could have paid for it - is really concerned about us 'old farts'.

KnuckleDragger

So you use Ryan as an example when Romney is the one running for President? By the way, Romney is 65 which puts him in what you consider the old fart category. Those of us who are "young smell" are the ones who are being drug under by you old farts. The old farts who have the mindset of, as long as I get mine, who cares about the young guys who are paying into it now. Your comment shows your obvious content for the current generation of workers. Keep in mind pops, if us "young smells" all stopped working, you old farts would be out on the street to your own devices. Without current workers paying in your benefits would be toast. Got it?

John Harville

@Got it a looooooooong time ago. In fact a coupla people on here educated you to the process. So you'd vote for an 'old fart' to run the country?
Knuckle "The old farts who have the mindset of, as long as I get mine, who cares about the young guys who are paying into it now. Your comment shows your obvious content for the current generation of workers."
I don't have content (sic) nor contempt for the 'working generation' (of which you assume us 'old farts' are not). "As long as I get mine..." Yup, I paid for my parents' and grandparents' retirement. Why should you be exempt from the same duty?

John Harville

@Knuckle... yeah, I'll use Ryan as an example because Rmoney has adopted/praised Ryan's budget AND would (will never) be the president of a 50/50 Senate.

sanduskysteve

Well, here is the problem with Romney - he has done nothing but TALK about what his plan is - he has NEVER released anything to show what he really means - other than we KNOW he supports the RYAN plans - so there is nothing to indicate that his plan is any different. With that said - he can talk all he wants - we all know what RYAN has planned and it isn't good for even the already "old" people in this country. That person who doesn't think Obamacare is for her doesn't understand RYANs plan either or she would never have said that because Obamacare has nothing to do with Medicare - they are separate entities. As for Democrats being blind - we are not the blind followers of Rush, Beck, Hannity, or FOX NEWS. Those are the blind people who believes that if they say it - it is gospel. Stop listening to what others interpret documents - check them out for yourself and become educated in what you are talking about first - then talk, but from your OWN opinion - not that of others who have already admitted they will lie and cheat to get Obama out of office. They are scared to death of him.

mikel

prezo's plan: borrow money, create a plan that involves wasting taxpayer dollars trying to invent jobs, print more money, create a new type of welfare program, borrow more money, tell people how much better off they are today, print more money...i hope you get the pic. if not, re-read time and time again and then you get the pic.

sanduskysteve

The only picture I get is that whatever he is doing - it's working - maybe not at the fast pase of what Romney says he will do it (oh wait - he's talking 10 years to fix the budget and economy). Things are getting better - just stop listening to people and check things out yourself.

mikel

being a business owner i see it every day steve and the grass is not getting any greener!!

2cents's picture
2cents

Old farts in politics, LMAO, enjoy!!!

http://www.youtube.com/embed/RUh...

Contango

@ Kimo:

"Medicare"? You got your benefits. No worry for you.

How's this Ponzi scheme supposed to survive; raise taxes to confiscatory levels on the youth?

Heck, I even think that R&R are full of (bleep) on the voucher plan. This Ponzi scheme is goin' down.

sanduskysteve

This talk about a ponzi scheme is funny - it has been the same plan since it was started and just because Obama is in the WH - it's a ponzi scheme.

OMG.LOL.WT_

We should abolish Medicare and Social Security and let old poor people take car of themselves.
Then we would have the Utopia the Republicans envision.

sanduskysteve

Very well put - Romney already said "I'm not concerned about the poor". What makes everyone think he is lying about what he really believes. He has said the same thing with different words multiple times - 47% ring any bells?

Contango

@ OMG.LOL.WT_:

Some future legislature will abolish M&M and SS? Ain't gonna happen.

Remember Stein's Law: "If something cannot go on forever, it will stop,"

We're borrowing 40-50¢ of every dollar spent. Where's the money gonna come from? The rich ain't got enough to fix the spending problem.

Like all Ponzi schemes, the programs will 'end' - in a fiscal collapse.

Remember last yr's debate around raising the Fed debt level? Pres. Obama scared seniors by tellin' them that their SS checks may not go out.

They're pay-go systems: The money comes in, the money goes out. We borrow the balance needed.

the office cat

@Contango.You keep repeating this lie about the SS checks not going out. It had nothing to do with funding.
Congress was threatening to shut down the government, in which case the government would not be able to make SS deposits or send checks.
Actually YOU are the one trying to 'scare' people by perpetuating this lie.
Not unlike Rmoney who keeps advertising the Jeeps-to-China lie.

The Big Dog's back

Why do Repubs like crying fire in a crowded theater?

KnuckleDragger

Actually, that is lie. In the event of a shutdown the government is still required to send out social security, and military retirement pay. Get your facts straight. Obama lied, he couldn't have stopped payments if he wanted to.

Contango

@ the office cat:

"I cannot guarantee that those checks go out on August 3rd if we haven't resolved this issue. Because there may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it,"

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-5035...

Nah, he wasn't trying to scare seniors. LOL

mikel

"...she scoffs at Romney's suggestion that kids can borrow for school from their parents."

this is the typical response from people who do not take personal responsibility in helping their children. it's not like college just jumped out the door one day and said hey, i am here! pi$$ poor planning on their part does not constitute an emergency on my part. so, yeah, let your kids borrow the maximum that they can from student loans and then cry and whine about them being buried under a mountain of debt and then they can default on their loans like millions of others. fyi, student loans through gov't assistance programs NEVER go away unless they are paid in full.

deertracker

You can't REALLY default on a student loan now can you? Rmoney's suggestion is ridiculous and so is your comment. Sometimes parents don't have the money to lend. We can't all be super rich like you!

mikel

deertracker - my comment is not ridiculous. having the thought that my kids would go to college when they were born we saved money. had cd's, made our kids work through the summer breaks putting aside a portion of those monies. we were able to loan our children some money and yes, they had to take out a small college loan. again, college is something that does not sneak up on anyone. in most cases people have 18 years to plan for it.

the office cat

@Mikel I sure hope they went to a private college like Hillsdale and not some public college for which we taxpayers paid most of the costs - or some other private college which accepts Pell Grants and Staffor Loans and government-secured loans.
Sometimes college does 'sneak up' on families - families who have never had anyone go to college let alone graduate; families who always had family businesses they thought would carry on; families whose college funds collapsed with the banks and the economy; families who had unexpected catastrophic illnesses or incidents.
You spend so much pontificating from your castle on the hill that you refuse to acknowledge others are not as fortunate as you - usually through no fault of their own.
You are deserving of our understanding and compassionate will to overlook the fact you, basically, are a damaged soul.

mikel

damaged soul, hahaha. i will do anything i can to help families with concerns that are legit. but when someone tells me that they can't afford gas for their car or food on their tables yet have their nails done, hair done, using the newest i-phones, wearing $100 shoes, going to cedar point 2-3 times per year, have the newest gaming systems etc etc, i lose my sympathy. we have become a country of wants over necessity and then it is someone else's fault that they don't have money.

btw puttytat, i have empathy for many families.

deertracker

You can't REALLY default on a student loan now can you? Rmoney's suggestion is ridiculous and so is your comment. Sometimes parents don't have the money to lend. We can't all be super rich like you!

2cents's picture
2cents

Correct, I started three CD's when my daughter was one, two and three. She is now attending her first year of college and with scolorships, good grades, and overall participaion. I think I have enought of it funded for her for the four years. After that she is on her own. I was 50% of those who chose to create her so I am obligated to take care of her, educate her and send her down the path of life with the tools necessary to do so.

It really is about taking personal responsibility!

grandmasgirl

Good post. I also started a fund for my grandchildren. $20 a week doesn't sound like much, but it all helps. If the parents put in $20 and the other grandparents put in $20, it adds up. Give up a few of those fast food sandwiches, or a couple of beers, and give it to your kids. That's personal responsibilty.

eriemom

Well at that rate your grandchild will be able to pay for the first year's tuition at today's rates. What will they be in 18 years?

KnuckleDragger

Actually there are programs out there where you can purchase semester hours at todays prices to be used at a future date. I started one of these savings plans when I was in Utah for my kids and continue it today.

the office cat

Knuckle... good luck with that. People who started those years ago are finding out the plan doesn't work. Those are for public colleges and do NOT lock in the tuition rates at the time you start paying. Does this mean you are restricting your kids' choices of college to what you've deposited for?

mikel

you may not have saved enough for the entire college cost but anything you can do along those lines will certainly help.

KnuckleDragger

The program put together by the state of Utah does. I have the papers right in front of me, and yes it is for public colleges. I never claimed it covered private college tuition. Yes I am restricting where my kids go to school. If I pay for it, I have a say in it. They are free to go wherever they want on their dime. Apparently you are of the school of thought that taxpayers should pay for whatever school a person wants to go to? I wanted to go to Harvard but could only afford Ohio University. I would be happy for you to pay for my Doctoral studies at Harvard if you wish?

deertracker

No parent is OBLIGATED tosend their child to college. I hope they all get a job!

Randy_Marsh

I would say a parent has more of a obligation to send their kids to school than the entire society having to pay for it.

deertracker

Society is not OBLIGATED either. When you repay your loans, society is off the hook!

Randy_Marsh

Deertracker
I agree. The problem is personal responsibility is not a high priority these days and a contract is not binding if you whine loud enough.

Contango

@ deertracker:

Repay? Better check recent student loan default rates:

"The percentage of borrowers who defaulted on their federal student loans within two years of their first payment jumped to 9.1% in fiscal year 2011, up from 8.8% the previous year, according to U.S. Department of Education data released Friday."

Looks like a repeat of the sub-prime housing bubble burst!

http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/28/...

sanduskysteve

Hmm - well first let's remind you once again that the student loan remains with you for ever, they never default until it's paid. If it ends up on your credit report - it is there until it is paid in full - no way to remove it prior to that - so you do end up in a fix if you wish to purchase something on credit while it is not being paid. Also, student loans continue to rack up interest until it is paid - again there is no "write off" available which stops the collection process and the interest - it continues to grow - which continues to damage the debtor's credit.

Now, let's also look at your figures and match them to the employment figures. Seems to me to be normal that if there are no jobs for these graduates, then their loans are not going to be paid until they can get a job. The payments on the loans generally start 6 months following graduation. Unless you drop out early, then the payments start immediately.
Do some homework before just spewing tainted information.

the office cat

@2cents. Were those private scholarships to private colleges that don't accept Pell Grants or Stafford Loans or federally-backed loans? Cuz I certainly hope none of my tax dollars would intrude on your glorious self-image. I'm so happy you think you 'have enough of it funded...for the four years'. Have you ever sent a child to college? It sounds as if she is your 'only'. What if it had been necessary to open CDs for two or three children? Having helped two through college, I assure you there are a lot of pitfalls for which you haven't prepared.

KnuckleDragger

Agreed mikel. If you can't send your kids to college then the kids can either work their way through, or go into the military to get it paid for. I'm sick of the excuses. My parents weren't poor but they sure as heck didn't pay for my college education. I used a combination of military tuition assistance and my own money to obtain a Bachelor's degree. I used my own money from working to complete my Master's degree. Did it take a bit longer? Yes, 8 yrs for my Bachelor's and 5 years for my Master's. The end result was the same, an education without debt.

the office cat

@knuckle. So you used government assistance. Who passed the GI Bill? Who recently extended it and expanded it for current military. So you disagree with Rmoney that kids should borrow from their parents?

deertracker

He still gets a gubment check!

KnuckleDragger

Still sounding like an idiot I see.

KnuckleDragger

Actually I think that kids should work their way through school like I did. It gives them a better appreciation of the education that they received. Despite deerhumpers idiotic assertion that career military people don't work for the benefits they receive, and fail to see the difference between an earned benefit and retirement and a welfare check. Deertracker has long had an inferiority complex due to the fact that he has to be supported by his wife.

sanduskysteve

Wait a minute - I thought retirement (SS) was considered an entitlement???? Are you telling me it actually is a "benefit"??? By the way - while active you were exempt from federal income tax - why aren't you upset that Romney called you a victim who will never take personal responsibility for yourself? You're actually going to vote for him and support the man that called you a name. How strange.

deertracker

Double post!

Contango

@ deertracker:

So after seven weeks, what's the "official" WH story on Benghazi?

Are they still sticking with the spontaneous riot and the video story?

deertracker

You really got your tightie whities all bunched up about Benghazi! Relax, don't panic!

Pete

Relax, don't panic!

Is that what Obama The Clueless is telling Chris Steven's mother?

Oh that's right, he hasn't said anything to her!

mikel

oh snap!

deertracker

Where did you learn that....... BET?

mikel

white house.

deertracker

Do you really care about Stevens or are you just using this to vent about the President? I bet the latter. What about those 4000 soldiers that died for a LIE? Oh snap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Contango

@ deertracker:

"A lie"? Where's the "official" Congressional Report on the Iraq War?

So the fact that so many Dems voted for the Iraq Resolution means what; that they were lied to and were stupid or that they were co-conspirators?

deertracker

Where's the WMD? Where? They were lied to just like you and I but the President......Senator at the time....... did not fall for it. Smart guy!

Contango

@ deertracker:

The Dems had the same Intel as the Bush Admin. So were they stupid or co-conspirators?

Pres. Obama was not a U.S. Senator in 2002.

KnuckleDragger

LMAO! BABOOM!!! Funny how he didn't even know Obama wasn't even a Senator at the time Congress voted to go to war with Iraq. I guess in his defense, he does his fact checking on MSNBC, and liberals believe they are never wrong. Just FYI deertracker, Obama wasn't a Senator until January 4, 2005. LOL. Smack!!! Darn Fruit Flies.

deertracker

You are right GOMER. Still a very smart guy though.

Contango

@ KnuckleDragger:

Yea, I was livin' in Chicago at the time and my first "wiff" of Mr. Obama was when Jack Ryan, his Repub opponent's "sealed" divorce records "mysteriously" showed up.

I'm pretty politically astute and I never even heard of the guy until he ran for the Senate.

It's not like he was some major IL politician or sumpthin.

deertracker

Maybe not all that "astute" afterall. Now he is the President, surprise surprise! You act as though he broke into the courthouse and stole the records. Five million to a charity of your choice if you can prove it!

Contango

@ deertracker:

You obviously don't know Chicago Democrat machine style politics. LOL

BTW: He lied to the people of IL when he said that he would complete his term:

On "Meet the Press" Jan. 22, 2006, Tim Russert and Sen. Obama had the following exchange:

Russert: "When we talked back in November of '04 after your election, I said, 'There's been enormous speculation about your political future. Will you serve your six-year term as United States senator from Illinois?'

Obama: 'Absolutely.'"

KnuckleDragger

You don't have enough lifetimes, or welfare checks to pay off a bet like that :)

Contango

@ KnuckleDragger:

IL has the worst credit rating of any state.

Gov. Quinn (D) raised income taxes to help pay down the debt. Corps. complained, threatening to leave the state and he cut 'em deals

Now the state is takin' in less revenue than before the tax increase. LOL.

Glad I got out when I did.

What the Dems have done for IL (and Detroit) they can certainly do for the U.S.

KnuckleDragger

What lie was that deertracker? Are we talking WMD in Iraq? Were you there? Have you ever gotten out of your chair and served your country in the armed forces? That's what I thought. Was in Iraq, WMDs were in fact found. Actually, enough mustard, as well as materials to make nerve gas to take out most of the middle east. Iraq had much more than was found however they had moved a great deal of it to Syria prior to the war. If you were paying attention part of Iraq's stockpile was found recently in Syria. Quit watching PMSNBC and you may have actually heard it reported.

deertracker

Go away Gomer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KnuckleDragger

Pot, meet Kettle. Gomer, LOL. I guess I should take that as compliment coming from you.

Contango

@ KnuckleDragger:

Shazam! :)

KnuckleDragger

I'm not sure why I respond to him. He is about as intelligent as a fruit fly. Cheap entertainment I guess, and since I'm stuck in my house with both ends of my road flooded, I have plenty of time to argue with him. ;)

deertracker

My suggestion is....Don't respond!

KnuckleDragger

OK there little Deerhumper.

deertracker

Shazam???? You are just too old!

deertracker

I could have said Guber!

the office cat

Pete. You lie! the president met the families when their sons/fathers arrived home and met personally with the families...one reason Stevens' mother insisted rmoney stop using her son as a political weapon.

Contango

@ the office cat:

So why's the President so testy when asked for additional details?

Why no press conference after seven weeks?

the office cat

@con. why is a press conference necessary? Should we now conduct all wars and diplomacy by press conference? Besides, what will you harp on or try to use on the President after said conference. Did Reagan ever give a press conference on Iran-Contra?

Contango

@ the office cat:

So the WH is still sticking with the spontaneous riot over a video story?

The lack of new info has become the story.

He was happy as a clam to tell the world about bin Laden.

Face it: It just ain't "optimal" this close before an election to talk about it.

Contango

@ deertracker:

Expecting an honest answer or maybe a press conference regarding what the WH knows about the Benghazi "act of terror," after seven weeks shouldn't be expected by Americans?

The timing isn't "optimal" so close before the election is it?

the office cat

@Con how many years was it before Oliver North talked about Iran-Contra.

Contango

@ the office cat:

So Mr. Obama is covering something up?

eriemom

Instead of trying to make a political statement out of the death of an American Diplomat, try reading something from a friend of the man.

Through emails just prior to his death he made it clear that we should, "Stay the course."

Contango

@ eriemom:

Why is asking for answers out of this WH always framed as partisan and political?

Is he the (bleepin') President or not?

If this were Pres. Bush would you still be patient with a seven week old stonewall?

And don't tell me that the election has nothing to do with it. He just hopes it goes away.

Now he's got Sandy, so he can try to look presidential again.

the office cat

@Contango. Acutally I'm still patient with a 9-year stonewall on Iraq and the 9/11 and where he was while the attacks were ongoing and where the WMDs were. And OMG it's been a 32-year stonewall about Reagan making a deal with Iran not to release the hostages until his inauguration day. Seven weeks? A bit wimpy on your part, doncha think.?

Contango

@ the office cat:

You're equating I-C and the Iraq War to Benghazi? So what do you think that the WH is covering up?

shucks

@ contango

I think I should sue you for plagerism.

The Big Dog's back

I want answers why Hurricane Sandy happened!

sanduskysteve

Here we go again - change the subject when it starts to hit close to home.

OMG.LOL.WT_

Remember the "Great Depression"?
1931*
R
R
D
1929
Hoover (R)
R
R
1927
R
R
R
1925
Coolidge ( R)
R
R
1923
R (Coolidge)
R
R
1921
Harding (R)
R
R

Contango

@ OMG.LOL.WT_:

The Great Depression lasted from 1921 to 1931? What are you attempting to write?

sanduskysteve

LOL - I thought it was self explainatory to me - he covered the dates from 1921 to 1931 pretty complete - just in the opposite order - no harm done there - I also notice there is only ONE "D" showing in those years. Funny how the D appeared in the last year - hmm at the time of RECOVERY??? The Rs it would appear had a hard time fixing the problem. Sounds just like today if you ask me.

Randy_Marsh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t... Obama supporters. Enough said!

goofus

Benghazi coverup, and now this. The job and labor report due today is UNEXPECTICALLY(LOL) late The construction and factory orders due Friday will be late according to the Census. Both will CONVIENTLY(LOL) be released after the election. What a buch of crooks we have in the WH.

Contango

An Obama campaign ad about the music on his iPod was airing while the hurricane was hitting.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/poli...

It's from Obama Media - ABC.

Can his handlers make this guy look any more out-of-touch?

Time to send Mr. "Cool" back to his home planet of Vulcan.

sanduskysteve

Just an FYI - Obama did not specify when the ads will run - or anyone who puts out political ads. The TV stations block those ads as to when they air. They are required by law to air so many within certain time periods. No argument needed on this - I was an engineer at a television station and I know how that works. Can't blame when an ad is aired on Obama - nice try though.

OMG.LOL.WT_

To those who need explanation:
The R is for Republican.
They controlled it all from 1921 up to the crash of 29.

Contango

@ OMG.LOL.WT_:

Far too simplistic of a conclusion as to causality.

Regardless, FDR didn't end the Great Depression, only WWII did.

Are you suggesting that Mr. Obama should start a war?

The Big Dog's back

Government spending did.

the office cat

@Contango: Too simplistic? Buying on margins? Prohibition which gave birth to organized crime? Banks failing?
FDR didn't end the Great Depression. No one person ends a depression or recessioin - something a lot of you don't seem to grasp. But FDR and Congress DID put people back to work - NRA, CCC, WPA - and a lot of other alphabet soup. Schools and post offices and other structures were constructed. Cities and towns got sidewalks and brick streets. The TVA ended annual floods and brought electric power to the country.
Nobody but you has suggested Obama start a war. FDR didn't start a war either but he had kept auto plants open so they immediately switched to production of tanks and airplanes and the shipyards were ready to build ships.
Obama inherited two wars - ended one - but this time the wars Bush started crippled the economy.
However, if mobilization is needed again, we still have auto factories to build tanks and such.
Should we note that eventually - after all the progress and rescuing - the Supreme Court ruled the NRA unconstitutional?
YOu go, OMG. Repubs don't like to admit what happened in the 20s and early 30s because it put them out of power almost 50 years - even Ike would have been a Democrat today (think about that as you tool along the NDH system of roads))

Contango

@ the office cat:

You can still buy stocks on margin.

So trillions more of massive govt. deficit spending will propel our country to prosperity?

So why don't you get out your credit cards and charge your way to wealth?

coasterfan

It's sad to see just how well the Romney progaganda machine is working. To think that there are actually people voting for Romney BECAUSE they're worried about losing their Medicare benefits. This is like the hen voting for the fox, since Romney plans to turn Medicare into an out-of-pocket voucher system. Unfortunately, they won't figure it out until the bills start arriving in their mailbox for medical treatments/meds they used to get 100% free through Medicare.

In case anyone hasn't heard, the $716 billion of Medicare cuts that Romney and Ryan are lying about is NOT a cut in anyone's Medicare coverage by Obama. It's $716 billion in SAVINGS - FOR consumers. Doctors would be paid less for some services, which means WE pay less. Also the SAME $716 billion in "cuts" is contained in Ryan's budget proposal!!!

It is good to know that some people have taken time to wade through the misinformation. Congrats to the mom in this article with 3 kids in college, who understands that Romney plans to abolish the college tuition tax credit, and plans to cut funding for college Pell grants. Obama, in contrast, will continue to work to increase funding for Education and college grants. For this mom, the Romney Plan would take $3000-5000 out of her pocket...

And all so that we can give millionaires another tax cut they don't need.

KnuckleDragger

That savings you are talking about isn't really savings. Seniors will have to pay for it by dwindling choices of Dr's who will take on Medicare patients. If they keep cutting payments, eventually seniors only options will be to go to the ER or the Health Department for care. Apparently this is what liberals would rather have than a viable plan to make medicare solvent.

deertracker

Rmoney said that is what the ER is for. You know, that safety net!

The Big Dog's back

robme/ryan plan for Medicare- Couponcare!

Contango

coasterfan writes:

"Doctors would be paid less for some services, which means WE pay less."

Magical Obamanomics!!!

Any business can only offer three things: Price, quality and service.

Pick two, 'cause you can't have all three.

Asking doctors to accept less in payment will result in either lower quality or poorer service - guaranteed.

So if teachers were paid less, students would learn more? :)

KnuckleDragger

Contango, it will result in little service. I already know doctors who won't take on anymore medicare patients and that are phasing them out of their practice by attrition. Medicare already pays less than the cost of providing care. Anymore cuts to reimbursement will lead to most doctors dropping out altogether, leaving seniors in the same boat as Medicaid patients.

eriemom

This is the second time that you have posted this statement. Please name the doctors. As far as I know you never answered this question.

Contango

@ eriemom:

A Letter to the Editor from a doctor I recently read:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB...

eriemom

Wall Street Journal opinion from a person living in Texas. Knuckledragger posted the statement, but I would accept a local doctor's name from you as well, Smith. It is not difficult to fact check a local doctor now is it.

Contango

@ eriemom:

So that doctor was lying?

Do you have a family phys.? Go talk to him/her.

KnuckleDragger

So now you want me to call out Dr's in a public forum? I can tell you my Family Physician has stopped taking Medicare patients. Maybe you should befriend a few, they might tell you. Call around and ask several offices if they are accepting new medicare patients and you may be able to answer your question, especially specialists. Had to get my mom into an ortho doctor and nobody in Sandusky would take on a new medicare patient. Had to take her to Toledo.

mikel

who, in their right mind in a free enterprise system, would take medicare patients when the fed gov't is going to cut their payouts??? maybe the feds can take all medical personnel that are behind on their student loans and make them work it off!!

sanduskysteve

Funny how this is working out - no real answers. Not taking new patients. Why not? Just because they have medicare is a stupid reason, to be honest. If you own a business - would you rather get less business at very high charges or more business with a few smaller charges??? And I'm sure there are probably tons of doctors who are behind on their student loans. Maybe THIS is the real reason they are afraid.
On the other hand - this will mean a huge opening in this country for more and more doctors and nurses. I think it will end up increasing jobs (OH MY, CAN NOT DO THIS NOW CAN WE?). It would seem to me that creating higher paying jobs would be a good thing as a result.
And, instead of condemning Obama for trying to same taxpayer money from over charging doctors and hospitals simply because the government is paying the bill, you should be behind him for assisting with cutting the ripping off of your tax dollars by private industry. Oh wait, that's exactly what republicans want and look forward to!!! And you guys have not explained how Obama's cut to payments for medicare are any different than the same plan from RYAN. Stop beating a dead horse and just answer the questions. I can tell who the republicans are on here - they are the ones that refuse to answer a question with a straight answer - funny how this is a trait shared by even RYAN and ROMNEY.

deertracker

Do you really think the quality is good now!? Sounds like Contangonomics to me!

Contango

@ deertracker:

So to improve the quality, doctors should be paid less?

the office cat

@Contango. Yes.
Paying them more hasn't worked.

Contango

@ the office cat:

Got any stats to back up that nonsense?

I've been reading for a couple yrs. that there's a doctor shortage, payin' them less should help improve the employment numbers eh?

Randy_Marsh

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained Personal attacks (including: name calling, presumption of guilt or guilt by association, insensitivity, or picking fights).

sanduskysteve

How about those doctors that continuously spend money on top of money for things not needed just because the government is paying the bills and charging more to medicare than they do to insurance companies just starting doing the right thing instead of trying to get richer and richer off ME, yes the taxpayer's dime. How about if they don't want to take the patients - then yes, this will help unemployment greatly. You guys don't want to count the part-time workers as employed - how about a bunch new doctors coming out of medical school?? Would you consider them employed?? So, yes, by making the doctors and hospitals accountable with taxpayer money, it would actually help unemployment. I don't consider myself stupid - I can just think for myself and don't rely on some radio talk show host or television station to tell me what to think and why.

mikel

great. let's ask the doctors to stop ordering more tests. fine with me. expect the unemployment to rise with all of the x-ray techs, med techs etc having less work which means that their employers will need less of them. great suggestion steve.

sanduskysteve

It was the medical profession that decided to start doing that crap to begin with! We will still need those professionals. But let's be honest (not that this is possible for a republican) - if someone has insurance or medicare there are many extra tests done just because they will be paid for - and this includes medicaid as well. Also, you see a lot of the same tests done multiple times as you shove the patient from one doctor to another. The previous test results COULD follow the patient couldn't it? It does when the patient doesn't have insurance. Yes, a great suggestion in my opinion to stop the overcharging from hospitals and doctors just because someone has insurance or medicare or medicaid. And you guys should be all over it - especially since Ryan and Romney think the same thing.

the office cat

@Contango. Stats: where to begin. At least five reports by medical providers and insurance companies... but you've been 'reading' for two years so you know that.
Personal experience? Specialist had to order a second scan because the first was unreadable due to technician error - $2,600. "Everything appears to be okay though difficult to read" written comment from cardiologist 'reading' a difficult ECG - $3,400 - $1,200 for the 'reading'. Equipment stopped producing data halfway through a brain scan that required running tube through groin to put dye in brain...$6,000 for the procedure after the equipment was fixed. The out-patient procedure required a hospital stay at an additional $3,000.
Then there is the doctor who schedules three appts every 15 minutes - including the pharmaceutical salesman who got the first slot - and charges $77 which he can collect just for taking BP/weight and listening to heart and lungs (insurance companies require at least three procedures to pay).
Then he has to leave because he gets a call his plane is fueled and ready to leave for his 3:00 court in Cleveland.

eriemom

Who are your voters?

In Ohio we understand that President Obama has saved thousands of jobs that are a part of the auto industry chain. We also see nominee Romney running scared, because he now understands that his stand on the auto bailout was a mistake. Unlike other mistakes that he has made, and changed through the course of the primary and presidential election, this one will not just go away. He cannot lie his way out of it. Today Chrysler put out a statement that told as much.

Randy_Marsh

Eriemom
So you trust large corperations to keep their word now? Are you a browns fan by chance? HA!

sanduskysteve

Very good point - Bain Capital comes to mine.

mikel

romney never said that it was a mistake! there is absolutely no proof that gm and chrysler would not have emerged from bankrupcy following normal procedures. unless of course, you are drinking the prezo kool aid.

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