Debate reverses roles

Republican Mitt Romney is acting like a challenger who feels he has enough momentum and time to overtake the president by Election Day, two weeks from now. Judging from Monday's final debate,
Associated Press
Oct 23, 2012

 

 

President Barack Obama almost seems to agree.

Obama was clearly the more aggressive combatant in the 90-minute forum, whacking Romney's personal investment record, truthfulness and overseas fundraising. Romney, meantime, went out of his way to blunt his differences with the president on several key foreign policy matters — supposedly the debate's focus — and to appear calm, moderate and non-threatening.

Romney's approach was one typically taken by front-runners: First, do no harm. Don't stir the pot. Keep the clock running.

Obama's forcefulness appeared chiefly aimed at discouraged Democrats who might not bother voting, rather than at the sliver of undecided voters in the handful of states still in play. Romney is not the benign, acceptable alternative he claims to be, Obama seemed to be saying, and I, your president, am finally willing to fight tooth and nail for a second term after sleepwalking through the first debate, which triggered Romney's rise in the polls.

"It's all get-out-the-vote now," said Matt Bennett, a veteran of Democratic campaigns. "If you're undecided now, you ain't voting."

"Obama will win the debate on points," Bennett said, "but it won't matter much."

A number of other Democrats shared that view. Interest in the third and final debate probably suffered, they said, from voter fatigue, competition from televised football and baseball games, and the official topic — foreign policy — in a campaign dominated by jobs and the economy.

These Democrats, however, don't necessarily think Obama will lose. Some feel Romney took a big gamble by being so tame in the final face-to-face encounter.

Obama still holds a slight edge in Ohio in most independent polls. It's the state that can almost seal the president's re-election if he holds it, because it would force Romney to sweep virtually every other contested state, including tough Wisconsin.

Romney's stay-the-course demeanor Monday points to confidence that his slight rise in the polls will continue, even if only a smidgen of voters are truly undecided. Democrats note that many thousands of people are already voting through early balloting programs in key states.

The election's outcome may turn on whether Obama's get-out-the-vote ground troops can outrun Romney's momentum. Polls show Romney doing considerably better among likely voters, as opposed to registered voters. That gives Obama's volunteers a chance to hunt down thousands of "soft supporters," and persuade them to get to a polling place.

From the debate's opening minutes, Romney showed no appetite for verbal fisticuffs. Moderator Bob Schieffer invited the former Massachusetts governor to critique Obama's handling of the fatal attack on a U.S. Consulate in Libya, a topic Romney had fumbled in the second debate, six days ago.

Romney showed no interest. Instead, he congratulated the president on the killing of Osama bin Laden, hoping to negate an Obama strong point as quickly as possible.

Throughout the evening, Romney continued a recent trend of moderating his foreign policy positions. He seemed bent on presenting himself as a sound commander in chief, even if it required him to narrow his differences with the president.

Romney offered unusual praise for Obama's war efforts in Afghanistan, declaring the 2010 surge of 33,000 U.S. troops a success and asserting that efforts to train Afghan security forces are on track to enable the U.S. and its allies to put the Afghans fully in charge of security by the end of 2014.

Romney said U.S. forces should complete their withdrawal on that schedule. Previously he has criticized the setting of a specific withdrawal date.

And on Iran, Romney mollified his previous criticism of Obama's sanctions policy. He stressed that resorting to war to stop Iran from developing a nuclear weapon would be a last option, softening the hawkish tone that had been a hallmark of his campaign.

Longtime GOP strategist Terry Holt defended Romney's soft touch.

"His first goal is to appear presidential," Holt said. "This is not a grand jury where all he has to do is indict. People are looking to him for presidential qualities. Cool, calm and clear."

Obama, by contrast, looked for every chance to criticize Romney on as many topics as possible.

"Governor, when it comes to our foreign policy, you seem to want to import the foreign policies of the 1980s, just like the social policies of the 1950s and the economic policies of the 1920s," Obama said.

He chided Romney for having said Russia was America's greatest geopolitical foe. "The Cold War's been over for 20 years," Obama said.

"Presidents always have an advantage when debating foreign policy," said Republican consultant Matt Mackowiak. "Romney did well enough tonight to maintain his momentum and win this race."

Obama has 14 days to stop that momentum. He plunges in immediately Tuesday with events in Delray Beach, Fla., and Dayton, Ohio. On Wednesday and Thursday the president plans to campaign in Iowa, Colorado, California, Nevada, Florida, Virginia and Ohio.

Romney and his running mate, Paul Ryan, on Tuesday were headed to Nevada and Colorado. Romney planned to campaign Wednesday in Nevada and Iowa, and Thursday and Friday in Ohio.

Neither ticket can afford to write off the other competitive states. But Ohio seems destined to be the testing ground of whether Obama's tiny lead and big ground operation can hold off Romney's October momentum.

Comments

eriemom

I watched the gender gapped reaction lines during the debate. It was distracting at times, but also telling. Many studies have shown that women are better at "reading" facial and body language than men are. Mr. Romney studied well. He did everything he was taught to do, or not do, in some cases.

Gentlemen: We don't trust him. It is not so much what he says. It is not even the way that he explains his plans or his position on the issues. It is that what we see does not match up.

KnuckleDragger

Either you are wrong, or the polls are wrong. The one I read today has Romney gaining in the area of women, especially ones who are married. Single women can't see past one issue; abortion. The facts are the facts, women are doing worse under Obama than they did under Bush.

John Harville

Filling his binders?

KnuckleDragger

Take a look at the unemployment rate among women, the pay of women, heck look at what Obama is paying the women in his cabinet (less than the men). Maybe, then you can figure it out.

KURTje

It is right or wrong...many times that is E-Z to discern. All ya godda do is vote.

Home Boy

WE?? WE? Speak for your self eiremom. What I, ya that's I, not 'we' don't trust is another four years of what our (ya, our)president has given us. And don't come back with the blame game. "We" are tired of that BS. Just look at the record....unemployment, deficit, debt, food stamps, and the Middle East. the record speaks for itself. Talk about trust!

deertracker

You have to ask how we got here. It's only the blame game if it were not true. We are tired of the cons not owning up to the mess they created. During any recession there's going to be increased unemployment, gov't assistance, debt, etc. You can not blame all of this on the President just because you choose to ignore facts. What about the middle east? Our goal is to take care of home first. Those people don't even like America so what is your point? While you are looking at records, look at all the records not just those that you THINK support your point of view. Obama has done almost everything he said he was going to do. We are not sorry that he has not fixed your mess quick enough.Things are improving and will continue with a little help from all Americans. The cons talk a good game but everytime they are in charge things get worse.

Riskkbreaker

Over the past 110 years, the Democrats have had control of congress for upwards of 80% of the time, and half of the presidencies (not to mention the way that the school system and Hollywood have continually fed us the Left Wing paradigm for decades now).
Who really caused this mess? http://www.commentarymagazine.co... Read all the way through..Bush versus Obama.

Due to Americans being tired of the war, the Dems got control of Congress again in 2006 and held it until 2010.
They also won the presidency in 2008 on, again, mostly anti-war sentiment (even though they voted to fund those wars and their candidate has done a 180 degree spin on the wars, away from his campaign promises, after he got elected).

Clinton robbed the Social Security piggy bank, so he didn't actually balance anything. He also signed legislation that led to the housing crash..Bush tried to fix Fannie and Freddie but Democrats Dodd/Frank blocked him.
Granted, Republicans are not perfect, but how much of their mistakes are a result of what the Democrats have dumped on society?

And when are people going to realize that Democrats are the only party which has started a war against their own country (the Civil War) because they were enraged that Republicans were helping women and minorities to stand on their own two feet?
Does it seem, lately, like the Dems are are trying to brew up another Civil War?

eriemom

Are you kidding me? That is the story that they feed you in the south about the Civil War?

Riskkbreaker

I will copy paste a comment from someone else, who replied to the implication you just made. And I quote:

"Perhaps those who attribute “fight against slavery” as the cause of the Civil War are not as “simplistic” as indicated. A relationship is indicated in all 5 causes, so obviously they are not separate from slavery. It does seem central.

Free labor in the North (and) slave labor in the South. Major reason for nullification: maintain slavery.
Conflict over western lands: slavery.
Major reason South seceeded: slavery.
Reason Lincoln could not maintain union of states: slavery.
Production of cotton demanded: slavery.

It is more simplistic that so many in the South maintain that it was a fight over state’s rights as indeed it was: a fight by the South to maintain slavery."

Feel free to reply with something specific that refutes this.

the office cat

Who is 'someone else' since you seek 'something specific' in refutation.

Randy_Marsh

"Obama has done almost everything he said he was going to do" Except everthing he could blame Bush or anyone else for. The promise of cutting the deficit in half would be a good start to ask "WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING?"

John Harville

Ya! Hip to ya. Been round longer, tho and remember the same stuff in 84 when da saint was up for term two. duzya member ow dat cummed out?
14% mortgages and 18% car loans... and wut wuz dat iran-contra thing?

starryeyes83

Polls don't mean much... I like to play with the numbers as much as they do... and just for the fact they're bothering me. ;]

Contango

Pres. Obama is following much of Pres. Bush's foreign policy strategy and Gov. Romney said that he would essentially do the same.

Vote for "Obamney" - there's little difference.

BIN LADEN IS DEAD AND AL-QAEDA IS ALIVE IN LIBYA.

John Harville

Uh oh. We might agree. Even Romney says Obama has done/is doing a good job, congratulating him on bin Laden and other aspects of the President's performance.
Mitt must be worn out this morning after the long run Left to the Center and shakin' his Etchasketch with all his power. Of course Eddie Munster has to be scratchin' his head wonderin' what happened.

KnuckleDragger

Actually Romney's strategy in the last debate was pretty good. Remain calm, don't get to confrontational, and give Obama just enough rope to hang himself. He accomplished that in the third debate. Look at the fact checkers to see the number of times Obama lied versus Romney. The polls today show that what Romney did in the debate hasn't caused a drop in his support, in fact, the opposite in some polls. Keep on believin' Obama is gonna win, LOL.

HoMeMaKeR2005

team Barack Obama and just so you all know, I don't get any type of government assistance. I kno someone bound to say something about it, and no I get nothing. my husband works 70 hours a week :) anyways .... continue lol

rickross2

lol......Thats cute.

KnuckleDragger

Expect him to have to bump that up to 90hrs/week in the next 4 yrs under Obama. If Obama keeps spending and printing money like a drunken sailor the dollar will decrease in value to the point where inflation is inevitable. He will have to work 90hrs/wk just to put food on the table. Have fun with that, I'm sure your husband will be happy about it.

deertracker

Good for you Homemaker! The cons want to say if you support Obama you must be on welfare. That's just ridiculous. Firts, they were the only ones that believe in God, then they are the so called protectors of America...9/11 disproved that, now they are the sole engine that America runs on. Noise is all it really is. If your husband has to work 70 hrs. to make ends meet it is still better than just taking a handout and I applaud him for it. Real Americans do what they have to and don't whine about it.

HoMeMaKeR2005

Thank for understanding deertracker. guess there is just SOME people that take it out of context :)

John Harville

HoMe and the Deer: Since the husband is working 70 hrs/week, if it should be come necessary through layoff or accident or illness (God forbid on all three) to utilize 'assistance' it certainly would not be a 'handout' since he has been paying 'insurance' against such incidents in the form of payroll taxes - which means he and his family are 'entitled' to any assistance to which they might have to resort.
I am really so dismayed at people who deride others less fortunate who have to resort to 'assistance' because hard times have prevailed.
May God save all such people from personal awareness and experience of difficult times. And... thank God it's there for people who need it.

Riskkbreaker

That is not what we are saying and I think you know that.
We are saying that the very fact that people are in a situation where they do need it, is the problem that needs fixing.

We are also concerned that this need is growing at an alarming rate under our current President and, instead of fixing it, he makes it even worse and THEN misleads the country into believing that this was all inevitable.
THAT is what Romney is referring to when he says "I can't convince them." He feels that, under this President, they won't be convinced that there is another way.

And yes, there are people out there who also cannot be convinced that they should provide for themselves. There ARE people who believe that the world is 100% unfair and that the rich are evil and that the rich should take care of them. And they believe this as a matter of principle. Not the whole 47%, mind you (and probably not even half of the 47% thing). You CAN find these people around the internet, tho.

How narrow it is to ignore the problem (specifically, that elements within the Democrat party which are using the Cloward-Piven strategy to collapse the aid programs) and, instead of focusing on the solution, start chanting demagoguery.

I

HoMeMaKeR, here's a newsflash for you: You're supposed to support yourself without any type of government assistance. Doing so does not make you special.

John Harville

Eye. Really...'without any type of government assistance'? Is that your FINAL answer? Because if it is, then I want you to go in your house (assuming you own it free and clear and don't give money to somebody else to maintain it), lock the door and don't come out. If somebody tries to break in, don't you DARE call the police cuz I don't want you using any gubment assitance paid by my tax dollars. Same is true if it catches fire... don't you call the Fire Department. And don't go drivin' on those streets and roads the rest of us help pay for so you can get to work to support yourself. If you got kids in public school, pull 'em out. My kids are long graduated and I don't want you embarrassed by sending yours to a school supported by people who own property and pay taxes to support those schools.
And I DO hope you own property so you are paying property tax and not just freeloading off the rest of us who pay property tax to help support all the services I just mentioned.
And while you're locked away in your house we keep safe, drop to your knees and thank good God Almighty you don't need food stamps or rent assistance, or drug cards. You're the luckiest person in this entire area and all you can do is belittle somebody else who's makin' it.

HoMeMaKeR2005

One, I'm not belittling anyone. as deertracker has stated there's a lot of people out there stating that if you vote for Obama you must be on welfare. we are not. I would rather it go to people that really need it. such of an example would be the people that are losing jobs that have families to take care of. you pay taxes?? geez who knew? Get real John, everyone that works and lives in this city pays them, unless they are working illegally (under the table). doesn't make you special. I don't look down on people who receive assistance, hey you got to do what you have to do to survive. glad our tax dollars are going to someone who NEEDS it and not just someone who wants it. :) don't be so hateful, hate consumes you. have a blessed day John!

John Harville

I am being 'real'. Everyone that lives in this city is not paying taxes. But that doesn't matter.
My point remains that 'I' and others fail to realize that none of us lives here without taking some form of direct or indirect 'assistance'. Only certain people pay property tax - because they are able to own property. Only certain people pay local income taxes because they work - you can't pay taxes for 'living' here because there is nothing to tax. You can't pay payroll taxes if you don't have a payroll
But you can send your children to school here. You can drive on the streets and walk on the sidewalks. You do get the same fire and police protection. All those are forms of 'assistance'. They don't just 'happen'.
Note. My original comment with which you took issue was a response to 'I'.
Godspeed. May you be blessed with the power to discern.

HoMeMaKeR2005

I, never said I was special. again, totally took my posting the wrong way. deertracker knew exactly where I was coming from... don't be so negative :)

John Harville

But you felt it necessary to point out you support Obama and don't take any assistance - assuming you meant government assistance (food stamps, etc.) - because a minute group of posters make broad-sweeping generalizations.
You obviously are blessed. You are able to stay home and care for your family because your husband works 70 hours a week. You are able to avoid the hassles of shopping at Goodwill and similar locations to clothe your family. Through your own diligence you are able to feed your family without relying on any of the non-government assistance agencies and food pantries. I applaud you.
But I also applaud women who have to work to feed their families and sometimes need assistance.. Women like Jane. Her husband Dan brought home a high-end five-figure income by working two jobs. They had a nice house with a manageable mortgage, four children younger than 14 at home and one in the first year of college. Life was still a challenge but they were making it work.
Jane's phone rang one day. Dan was in the ER. He spent four months in a nursing home before he died one night in his sleep of a massive heart attack.

HoMeMaKeR2005

Sad story! I feel.for her! My heart goes out to her and her family! And she is one of.many that need the assistance and should get it! She has to support her babies! And I do shop at good will. best place ever! Love that store! that's how I myself make ends meet. Clothes are expensive along with everything else in this world. unfortunately lol but yes my heart and prayers go out to Jane and her children.and yes sorry the response to I was in the wrong place :/

reader

The only thing I am sure Romney believes is that he wants to be president.

John Harville

... and in President Obama. Rmoney did all but crawl into Obama's coat pocket and go home with him last night. He praised him on Osama, endorsed leaving Iraq in 2014, agreed with the President's plan to keep US troops out of Syria and the removal of its president, agreed with helping to form the 'correct' Syrian government.... Where WAS the Republican candidate?

Romney agrees "Vote for Obama"!

Contango

JH writes:

"He praised him on Osama, endorsed leaving Iraq in 2014,"

Leave Iraq in '14? What "debate" were you watching?

John Harville

Ah. you caught my typo. But you knew what I meant.

So. Thanks. I get to post it again. Romney agreed with leaving Afghanistan in 2014 - even though previously he had called setting a date a major foreign policy mistake.

And still he complimented the President on binLaden even though at the time he said we should have asked Pakistan for 'permission' and given them time to warn Osama.

Oh oh oh! And another one I didn't mention. ROMNEY gave full-out approval to using Drone strikes.

Thanks, Con!!

Contango

@ John Harville:

So I shouldn't believe that you write what you mean? :)

Drone strikes? It's getting ready to blow up on the Choomie in the WH; too many innocents are getting killed by the Nobel Prize winner's policies.

shucks

Romney DID give approval to drone strikes.

Contango

@ 4shizzle:

That's why you'll vote for "Obamney."

shucks

Eddi Munster wants to stay and Mitty Baby wants to leave.
These guys dont have it together and they want to lead us? WOW!

The New World Czar

Give credit to Romney for cutting off the loaded question by Bob Schieffer about getting the phone call with attacking planes in the air.

This in the end will come down to the economy.

John Harville

The economy? I hope so. Unemployment dropped in 41 states - including our all important state (7%) - in September and mid-October non-adjusted national unemployment projection is 7.3% for the November 2 report.

Obama got ground game in Ohio - which must be why so many Obama signs are being stolen while other signs remain in Democrat yards.

Contango

@ JH:

Fed. Chairman Bernanke said at Jackson Hole in Aug. that Fed policy is responsible for 2 million jobs.

Mr. Obama has little to "crow" about on the jobs front.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/ne...

John Harville

and Bernanke serves under Romney? Oops... typo... Bernanke serves under Obama and those 2 million jobs were added during the OBAMA administration.
...and mid-October projections of unemployment (not seasonally adjusted) to be reported November 2 are 7.3% - just in time for those three days of early voting that Husted fought soooo hard to stop. And all the experts - including you - say that a good November 2 report will determine the election for... well, I don't want to hurt your eyes.

Contango

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained Profane, obscene, sexual or derogatory language.

Contango

Mr. Obama got the "Three AM Call" with the Benghazi terrorist attack. He let it go to voicemail 'cause he was busy campaigning.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a...

John Harville

WOW. What kind of probe do you use to pull these things out? zat why you're always smilin'?

deertracker

Is it really fair to play the Monday morning quarterback when you have no first hand knowledge about the game?

Contango

@ deertracker:

Speaking of football; the current coach has been whining about the last coach for four years. Time to fire him.

Security shoulda been beefed up for the anniv. of 9.11. Why wasn't it?

Why still no declaration of "terrorist attack" from this WH?

------------------

BTW:

In the VP debate, Mr. Biden said that Iran is far from having a delivery system.

"Fat Man" and "Little Boy" are 1940s technology and the info. for their construction is public knowledge.

John Harville

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained Personal attacks (including: name calling, presumption of guilt or guilt by association, insensitivity, or picking fights) and Remarks advocating illegal or violent actions.

Contango

@ John Harville:

Show me where the WH used the term "terrorist attack" or mentioned al-Qaeda.

"Go count your gold and leave the serious stuff to the people with the intelligence to handle it."

Guess that leaves you out huh?

mikel

or we can just blame it on a movie right johnny boy.

John Harville

Mikel... thanks for putting my 'removed' comment back in by replying to it. C'mon Sarah... take it out again.

John Harville

How do you know security wasn't beefed up? Just because there was a 'hit'? Actually the Ambassador was taken into a 'safe room' in the embassy - but it wasn't safe from the 'firewash' the terrorists used. Now Moderator... is that better? Contango... did you complain?

Contango

@ John Harville:

So what's the "official" WH position on Benghazi 6 weeks later???

Guess it depends on the day.

goofus

Good ole deer poacher stating that things get worse when cons are in power! The fallacy is that true cons haven't appeared since the 2010 midterms, remember those elections and the pollling data preceeding them?
Romney by a landslide!!!!

John Harville

Romney under a landslide!!!!

Contango

Mr. Obama made himself look small by interrupting Mr. Romney and smirking during the topic of the Detroit auto bailout.

Remember: GM and Chrysler DID go bankrupt.

Read Mr. Romney's op-ed piece from '08:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/1...

----------------

VP Biden trusts the CIA and other Intel to know when Iran has nuke capabilty, but they were asleep at the switch on 9.11.12?

IMO, if Mr. Obama were a "leader" heads would roll regarding the Benghazi and 9.11.12 Intel failure.

John Harville

GM and Chrysler went bankrupt. And none of the commercial moneysources were willing to help them cuz they were busy going bust. The cure involved management employees losing part/all or readjusting their pensions - getting some of what has happened to the rank and file over the years. Isn't that the same method Kasich used to 'balance' Ohio's budget? OH, not quite. In Kasich's model public entities took the hit and now schools, hospitals, municipal police and fire depts, EMS are scrambling to find security while kids, patients and citizens suffer.

What if Romney had been president, implemented his plan, and nobody came forth with the money?

Contango

@ John Harville:

There were buyers in the wings.

Chrysler was sold to Fiat for one.

Mr. Romney mentioned "bridge loans," read the article and learn something.

John Harville

REad it... in '08. Would not have worked then and doesn't work now.

Contango

@ John Harville:

And "bridge loans" wouldn't have worked why?

A bridge loan was done for Chrysler under Pres. Carter.

The govt. has been doin' bail outs since before AmTrak. It continues to lose more than $1B annually.

So you bought a new GM vehicle and put your money where your mouth is?

themomx6

The latest Gallup Presidential Poll has shown Republican Mitt Romney with a large seven percentage point lead, the largest lead for Romney of any recent national poll.
Read more at http://www.enstarz.com/articles/...

John Harville

The Gallup I read - and the Rasmussen - from today was only at 5% with Obama still holding sway in Ohio. Fivethirtyeight - the only correct poll in 08 - has Obama with 293-243 in the Electoral college.
Prediction: In a reversal of 2000, Romney will win the popular vote and Obama will win the Electoral College.
Then Republicans finally will be ready to get rid of the College and let the people decide.

Contango

@ John Harville:

We'll all know on the morning of Nov. 7.

The Electoral College insures that the smaller states get a vote in the process.

Eliminating it would result in a Constitutional crisis.

Your lack of knowledge regarding politics shows why you're an extremist Choom Gang member.

KnuckleDragger

Good luck with that. It would take a Constitutional Amendment to get rid of the Electoral method of choosing the President. This would require ratification by at least 38 states. There aren't 38 blue states in the US. In fact the last maps I viewed had it between 18-20 states that are blue, and some of those are iffy. In other words, not gonna happen!

the office cat

Right, Knuckle... but you missed the point. If Rmoney wins the popular and Barry takes the Electoral AND the White House, the GOP will be clamoring for an end to the EC.

I

Romney seemed to be the more presidential of the two. With Obama attempting to mock Romney, as he does on the campaign trail and in his ads, the prez is following his game plan outlined in Saul Alinsky's book "Rules for Radicals". Rule #5: Ridicule your opponent. America is ready to get rid of the radical in the White House!

John Harville

Do you have your television set to delete-before-seen the negative ads against Obama, Brown, and others?
Obama got ground game.
Obama got Ohio and Romney can't get Wisconsin.

starryeyes83

I wonder if Romney stumped in Marion, IN.

Did he have a binder full then? ;]

mikel

ohhh this can't be!! prezo is a hero and has the economy running at 100% employment and everyone's pockets are flush with cash right? tell me i am right.....bahahahaha. blind bast...'s.

"12:01PM EDT October 23. 2012 - NEW YORK -- Stocks were trading sharply lower Tuesday after a new batch of weak earnings reports from major U.S.
companies reinforced fears that the economy remains fragile.

The Dow Jones industrial average was 1.8% lower and the broader Standard & Poor's 500 index was down 1.6% as the lunch hour approached.

The Dow had been down more than 250 points lower at one point. The Nasdaq composite index was off 1% in midday trading.

A trend that started off the quarterly earnings reporting season continues: investor disappointment about weakness in sales and revenues, signaling a lack of demand for goods and services."

John Harville

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained Personal attacks (including: name calling, presumption of guilt or guilt by association, insensitivity, or picking fights) and Personal information.

John Harville

Yep. I called out the Moderator and they dumped it. But I see "bast...'s" remains.

mikel

temper..temper. must be your nap time!

John Harville

and yet... "Even with the sharp declines, all three indexes are still up between 7% and 14% this year" - CNN (see, I give a source for my posts - something Mikel just can't seem to do).

mikel

give it time johnny boyyyy.

mikel

really johnny. playing this again? usa today.

the office cat

Mikel... what does it mean if, at 2:05 p.m., all the exchanges are UP?

mikel

nothing if, at the end of the day they are down. duh, duh, duh, duhhhhhh.

KnuckleDragger

In layman's terms, this means manufacturing layoffs are right around the corner. Rest assured, the Obama administration and the MSM will squash any reporting about layoffs until after the election. Hold on to your seats folks, double dip is on its way.

The Big Dog's back

mikel, do you have romnesia?

Contango

@ John Harville:

Mr. Bernanke has used quantitative easing (money printing) with the idea of inflating asset prices like stocks and commodities.

Thank the Fed for keeping this economy (so far) on life support, not the Choomie in the WH.

All the major central banks; the BOJ, the ECB and the Fed are printing, printing, printing.

Nor'easter

WHEN IS Obama going to pay up? He owes Sandusky Money too!

Subject: Interesting article in today's Akron Beacon Journal

-----Original Message-----
Subject: Interesting article in today's Akron Beacon Journal

Ohio is a key battleground state and all of the candidates have campaigned here during the past months.

Biden had a rally in Copley in August, Obama had a rally in Fairlawn in Sept, and Romney had a rally in Cuyahoga Falls just last week... these 3 communities are all within a 5 mile radius of Akron.

The cost of the Biden rally was $10,549 and Copley sent a bill to the "Obama for America" campaign but never received a penny.

The cost of the Obama visit was $34,166 and Fairlawn sent a bill to the Obama campaign but has never been paid either... this cost excludes a $21,304 additional cost for the Akron convention center which the Democratic Mayor of Akron donated for the "privilige of hosting a sitting president."

Romney's campaign visit ? They contacted Cuyahoga Falls in advance, organized the plan, and promised to pay any extra expenses the city would incur. The city sent them a bill for $7,050 and the Romney campaign promptly paid it in full.

Quoting the Mayor of Cuyahoga Falls, "I think it's self-evident who is accountable for their deeds and who isn't, who's accountable for their actions and who keeps blaming everyone else."

Indeed, there's a stark contrast between these candidates.
WHEN IS Obama going to pay up? He owes Sandusky Money too!

mikel

that is the difference between repubs and dems. repubs pay for their own and the dems think everybody but themselves should pay for theirs..ie the most entitlement monies ever handed out is by prezo himself.

shucks

Republicans borrow, Dems pay.
That's why Repubs hate taxes.

mikel

this is one of the dumbest posts ever!! what do you think your boy prezo is doing? you think he is paying the bills? why don't you check and see just how much he has borrowed from china to pay for his misgivings!

shucks

I suppose my post wasn't very clear.
Repubs send their debt forward to somebody else in the future, while in the present, spend like drunken sailors.
An unfunded war in Iraq and Afganistan?
Repubs always leave the USA in a financial mess.

mikel

and, just who do you think is going to pay for the mess prezo got us into right now? our children, grandchildren, great grandchildren etc. get the pic?

shucks

Thank your GOP for the debt.
The elephant symbolizing the Republican Party is correct.
After an elephant goes through, it takes a long time to clean up after it.
The Repubs left a big debt for Obama to clean up.
If you think Romney and Ryan are the better choice-- seriously, you need help

mikel

omg..get off the gop left prezo a big mess. lawmakers by the names of obama, biden, clinton, reid, pelosi, kerry, rangel, all of whom are dems, voted in favor of bush budgets thereby making themselves culpable in any financial duress that obama inherited.

got my help and they said go romney!

shucks

Try getting some competent help and it won't come from Romney.

sanduskysteve

the financial mess is partly from things which were NOT in the budgets they agreed to - LIKE THE WARS??? The China debt is because that's how he was financing the war. Geesh!! Do you think because it isn't in the budget it doesn't count?

shucks

Speaking of the wars- did we/USA ever get reimbursed with oil as Dick Cheney promised ?

the office cat

Aw poor Mike. How often must you be enlightened that the wars - and the China loans - were not IN the budgets until THIS president insisted they had to be included? If you remove the wars - and No Child Left Behind and Medicare Advantage - we probably even have a surplus. But we had to pay for those SOMETIME.

the office cat

Okay Mikel... here come the factcheckers. BUSH and the REPUBLICAN CONGRESS ran up the China debt to pay for unfunded wars that didn't have to be in the budget because they were military and weren't collecting taxes.
The huge China debt is our legacy from Iraq, pre-Obama Afghanistan, No Child Left Behind...kind of a 'charge it forward' mentality for those children and grandchildren you mention somewhere ad nauseum. Presently we have pay-as-you-go. Now, Teapublicans once yelled that's how it should be. Now it IS that way and you don't like it. Of course we're also paying the charge-it-forward bills. Why don't YOU check and see - and enlighten us - on how much 'in toto' has been borrowed from China and by whom?

shucks

nice work Cat

John Harville

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained Profane, obscene, sexual or derogatory language.

mikel

bastian's??

Randy_Marsh

Always the victim, Never the bride. you can always tell a Obama voter by how much they whine.

the office cat

tell us please... what is a 'blind bastian'?

rickross2

Get a job.

Contango

@ John Harville:

Mr. Obama's dope smokin' high school buddies were known as the "Choom Gang."

They were his "Choomies."

http://reason.com/archives/2012/...

The Big Dog's back

Maybe you should try some smoke winnie. Might chill you out.

shucks

How about George Bush's drug usage?

the office cat

Wondered too. So, calling the president a weed-smoker is okay, too?

the office cat

...but he was only QUOTING other people whose posts you left on.

thinkagain's picture
thinkagain

Obama has presided over the slowest economic recovery in the history of the republic. In a very real sense, there has been no recovery at all.

But don’t bother discussing matters like economic or foreign affairs with most Democrats. All most Democrat voters care about, is that Obama was on the "View", late night tv and honey-boo-boo endorsed him. smh

mikel

hahaha

goofus

Methinks John Harville needs some cheese with his whines. Why is the DNC borrowing money?

the office cat

AT least he uses his real name. If the DNC is borrowing money, it's probably because they don't have non-voting no-birth-certificate peoplecorporations pouring in trillions to buy the election.

Mr. Romney has the five qualifications he needs to be President...digits with which to hold the pen to sign Norquist's tax cuts.

Contango

Fact check:

Pres. Obama wrong on Iraq "status of force agreement":

http://www.businessinsider.com/d...

As the foreign policy "expert," Mr. Obama continues to take credit for an an agreement forged under Pres. Bush.

Mr. Obama is crashing on Intrade.

http://www.intrade.com/v4/misc/s...

shucks

Republicans borrow, Dems pay.
That's why Repubs hate taxes.

Contango

@ 4shizzle:

So Dems like paying taxes?

It's been estimated, that the U.S. would need to increase taxes by 35% on EVERYONE and reduce spending by an equal amount just to begin to put a dent in the Fed. debt.

Sound good to you?

shucks

It's not about "liking".
It's about being financially responsible.
Repubs always leave the USA in a financial mess.

Randy_Marsh

"It's about being financially responsible." So lets all elect the same guy who has spent more in 4 years than any president ever. Do you even know what being finacially responsible is?

shucks

The elephant symbolizing the Republican Party is correct.
After an elephant goes through, it takes a long time to clean up after it.
The Repubs left a big debt for Obama to clean up.
If you think Romney and Ryan are the better choice-- seriously, you need help.

Randy_Marsh

Look at the Democrat spending spree of 2007-2010 and beyond, By 2020 we will be at 20 trillion in debt. I personally think the two party system has everyone thinking this is the end all beat all of choices. At 9 tonight watch the other debate online and you will see some enteresting fixes for our fiscal problems.

The Big Dog's back

Sure it does winnie. Why should we pass the mess the Repubs made on the next generation?

Riskkbreaker

People go on and on about what Romney tells Republicans he believes in (while campaigning)..but they fail to note that these are things which he claims he would sign IF they were placed in front of him, assuming Congress will ever (in the foreseeable future) be able to place those actions within his reach.

These same demagogues fail to note that he seems to be pretty bipartisan in his record as governor. Compare that to the modern day civil war that Obama seems to be brewing up.

the office cat

1. ...his record as governor. Izzat why one of his 'home'* states has him down by big double digits?
*His other 'home' being Utah where the major newspaper endorsed the non-Mormon.
2. ..things he would sign... "On the first day..."? He's going to singlehandely repeal Obamacare...
3. He 'fully believes in" a woman's right to contraception and 'some' abortion would outlaw ALL abortion and declare life begins at conception.

OMG.LOL.WT_

I thought Mr. Romney sounded like a parrot.

shucks

Romney is a parrot and a puppet ( like Bush) of the GOP.

thinkagain's picture
thinkagain

I thought the whiner in chief sounded like a clueless moron, spewing lies in a desperate bid to convince what can only be described as the ignorant.

The Big Dog's back

Neverthinks, if the debate would have lasted another 30 minutes, rmoney would have endorsed Obama.

OMG.LOL.WT_

Want a Better Economy? History Says Vote Democrat!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/adam...

The Big Dog's back

Did you see where rmoney is ruining Halloween for the kids in Defiance? They had to cancel it because rmoney is coming to town.

Randy_Marsh

Maybe the kids parents will outsource the trick or treating, I know those in huron, Castalia,Monroeville, Bellevue and the rest of the surrounding towns do not have a problem with going to sandusky to get the loot. Alot like Outsourcing jobs, The government taxes the jobs to death so they move to greener pastures. You should approve of running off trick or treaters god knows you approve of the government taxing and pestering our jobs till they finally leave.

OMG.LOL.WT_

If The World Picked U.S. President, Election Would Be A Blowout
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-...

Romney would take Pakistan. HaHaHa

shucks

Hey Repubs !

Take a hint.

shucks

'

Randy_Marsh

Maybe you Dems should move then? The rest of the world loves Obama supporters, Especially libya i hear.

coasterfan

4 Shizzle, love ya! You are 100% correct.

Loved last night's debate. Obama got to play the wise adult, continually putting child Romney in his place. Mitt's complete lack of experience and lack of understanding with Foreign Policy came across loud and clear. Romney looked unhappy and out of sorts all night, while Obama looked in control and Presidential. CNN reader polls had more than 70% giving Obama the win. I was surprised that it was that close...

mikel

cnn = clinton news network. one of the hardest left leaning tv networks around.

coasterfan

And now Romney has to get middle class Ohioans to somehow believe that he cares about them, in spite of numerous comments he has made throughout the past year that speak otherwise. He has to somehow get Ohioans to forget that it was his Party that screwed up the economy, and get us to ignore the obvious fact that his economic plan is a carbon copy of Bush's. He has to somehow get Ohioans to ignore the fact that unemployment continues to drop in Ohio.

Frankly, we don't need someone telling us things are getting worse, when it's obvious that the exact opposite is happening. I paid $3.19 for gas in Fremont today. Forward...

Today's debate is brought to you by the Letter B.... Big Bird, Binders, Bayonets and Battleships

sanduskysteve

Unfortunately, we can't count our chickens just yet - just heard t hat the Romney family owns the company that owns the voting machines used in Ohio this year. What a crock is that??? I would call this a HUGE conflict of interest. Actually they are investors in that company - not really own it.

Riskkbreaker

I also heard that George Soros owns the company in Paris which will be counting the votes in alot of Democrat-run states.

This man is a known socialist and STILL considered to be an economic terrorist by a number of Asian countries.

sanduskysteve

And this matters how exactly? George Soros isn't running for the office being voted on by his own machines. What would you republicans be saying if Obama's relatives owned any of the voting machines??? OMG I can't imagine what a mess that would create. Come-on - you are typical of the GOP - can't argue the point, change the subject.

Darwin's choice

For coasterfan and big dog..............how about the "liar in chief" ??? "White House told of militant claim two hours after Libya attack, emails show" read on msn!!!!

the office cat

'Claim' being the operative word. Read on... three such groups have 'claiimed' responsibilities. So we should give them publicity before we know anything?

2cents's picture
2cents

Missing all the fun here :(
I spent the day in MI at an auto components trade show. It was funny how there was nobody looking at the electric vehicle component booths.
Obama bust!

Just observing!

the office cat

Really? When I was there several people were gathered around those 'components', asking questions and taking cards. Guess we were there at different times. Of course I was there after the Biden rally.

Mr. D

Hmmm. . . Romney made a life of buying companies, breaking them apart, selling off the bits and pieces, shipping jobs to china, causing massive unemployment here, was a major player in causing a terrible recession, destroyed lives and families by his actions. . . And now the guy who helped ravage America wants us to trust him to fix it???
Isn't that kind of like having the guy raped the wife and daughter and sodomized the husband be in charge of their counseling, therapy and recovery??? Just don't see it!

the office cat

But Romney's rapes were 'intelligent' rapes. Obviously, because we are recovering in spite of him.
And as the Indiana GOP senate candidate told us last night "a child conceived in the horrible action of rape was God's intention". Maybe it will be comforting to the folks in Freeport, IL who are having their factory moved to China by Bain - in which Romney has $8.8 milliion interest.

sanduskysteve

Romney was also a huge investor in Delphi - which benefited from the bail-outs and then moved to China.

the office cat

...and took management pensions with them and left the pensioners behind to demonstrate against Obama.

mikel

it is unfortunate that prezo never held a real job before having the senate seat given to him. otherwise one might be able to look at his work record but it is kinda hard to evaluate the work record when one doesn't have one.

sanduskysteve

What? I can't believe it - another - don't like the question? Change the subject. The point is that Romney actually MADE millions of YOUR taxpayer money in that Auto Bailout - has he returned any of that???? And by the way - if Romney arranged to move those plants to China - what makes you think he really is against this practice as he has been claiming for the past year? He isn't, and everyday another new bit of information comes out - I'm just shocked that Obama isn't killing him on these things - at least these are things that hit home - even in Sandusky - but no one cares about anything at all - other than getting O out of the WH - which is really a poor reason to vote for the bad guy - isn't it?

Oh, and by the way - just because it's true - let me add that the Mitt Romney bobble-head dolls - are made in factory in China which Ann Romney's brother owns. Hmmmm. We are going to get hard on China???? Not with a chinaman like Romney in the WH!!! Guaranteed on that. Didn't you know the Republicans love China? They can start false wars over fake information to get all of the country behind it and just let China finance it. Then when the bills start coming due - we'll just blame the new guy in the WH.

Someone said here that Democrats are only elected in order to show that we are tired of some war. Don't you think after all of this time (if that is really true), that the Republicans would wake up and realize THIS COUNTRY DOESN'T LIKE WAR??? It's costly and everytime there is a war - YES we elect a democrat! Democrats know how to stay out of wars and fix the mess created by a war!! Something in that makes a whole lot of sense.

Darwin's choice

Maybe this is the "real" obama you place so high on the pedastal......http://youtu.be/-jrEc7bTy4E..

Mr. D

@Darwin. . . Kind of doubt it. . . Looks more like one of whacked out political ads by the teatards. . .

2cents's picture
2cents

If you want to pick on anyone about China, you may want to start here.

http://world.hawaiinewsdaily.com...

Just saying!

shucks

An American corporation selling products from China, so?

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