29°Ground zero mosque: Misgivings and misinformation
Aug 19
2010
By CALVIN WOODWARD
Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON
A New York imam and his proposed mosque near ground zero are being demonized by political candidates -- mostly Republicans -- despite the fact that Islam is already very much a part of the World Trade Center neighborhood. And that Muslims pray inside the Pentagon, too, less than 80 feet from where terrorists attacked.
And that the imam who's being branded an extremist has been valued by both Republican and Democratic administrations as a moderate face of the faith.
Even so, the project stirs complicated emotions, and Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf is a complex figure who defies easy categorization in the American Muslim world.
He's devoted much of his career to working closely with Christians, Jews and secular leaders to advance interfaith understanding. He's scolded his own religion for being in some ways in the ''Dark Ages.'' Yet he's also accused the U.S. of spilling more innocent blood than al-Qaida, the terrorist network that turned the World Trade Center, part of the Pentagon and four hijacked airplanes to apocalyptic rubble.
Many Republicans and some Democrats say the proposed $100 million Islamic cultural center and mosque should be built elsewhere, where there is no possible association with New York's ground zero. Far more than a local zoning issue, the matter has seized congressional campaigns, put President Barack Obama and his party on the spot -- he says Muslims have the right to build the mosque -- divided families of the Sept. 11, 2001, victims, caught the attention of Muslims abroad and threatened to blur distinctions between mainstream Islam in the U.S. and its radical elements.
A look at some of the claims and how they compare with the known facts:
WHAT THEY SAID
--''The folks who want to build this mosque -- who are really radical Islamists who want to triumphally prove that they can build a mosque right next to a place where 3,000 Americans were killed by radical Islamists -- those folks don't have any interest in reaching out to the community. They're trying to make a case about supremacy.'' -- Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich, a potential 2012 presidential candidate.
--Some of the Muslim leaders associated with the mosque ''are clearly terrorist sympathizers.'' -- Kevin Calvey, a Republican running for Congress in Oklahoma.
--''This radical is a terrible choice to be one of the faces of our country overseas.'' -- Statement by GOP Reps. Ileana Ros-Lehtinen of Florida and Peter King of New York.
THE FACTS:
No one has established a link between the cleric and radicals. New York Police Department spokesman Paul Browne said: ''We've identified no law enforcement issues related to the proposed mosque.''
Ros-Lehtinen and King were referring to the State Department's plan, predating the mosque debate, to send Rauf on another religious outreach trip to the Middle East as part of his ''long-term relationship'' with U.S. officials in the Bush and Obama administrations. The State Department said Wednesday it will pay him $3,000 for a trip costing the government $16,000.
Rauf counts former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright from the Clinton administration as a friend and appeared at events overseas or meetings in Washington with former President George W. Bush's secretary of state, Condoleezza Rice, and Bush adviser Karen Hughes.
He has denounced the terrorist attacks and suicide bombing as anti-Islamic and has criticized Muslim nationalism. But he's made provocative statements about America, too, calling it an ''accessory'' to the 9/11 attacks and attributing the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi children to the U.S.-led sanctions in the years before the invasion.
In a July 2005 speech at the Bob Hawke Prime Ministerial Center in Adelaide, Australia, Rauf said, according to the center's transcript:
''We tend to forget, in the West, that the United States has more Muslim blood on its hands than al-Qaida has on its hands of innocent non-Muslims.''
While calling terrorism unjustified, he said the U.S. has supported authoritarian regimes with heinous human rights records and, faced with that, ''how else do people get attention?''
In the same address, he spoke of prospects for peace between Palestinians and the Israelis -- who he said ''have moved beyond Zionism'' -- and of a love-your-neighbor ethic uniting all religions.
WHAT THEY SAID
--''Mr. President, ground zero is the wrong place for a mosque.'' -- Rick Scott, Republican candidate for Florida governor.
--''Nazis don't have the right to put up a sign next to the Holocaust Museum in Washington. We would never accept the Japanese putting up a site next to Pearl Harbor. There's no reason for us to accept a mosque next to the World Trade Center.'' -- Gingrich.
--''Just a block or two away from 9/11.'' -- Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, another 2012 GOP presidential prospect.
THE FACTS:
No mosque is going up at ground zero. The center would be established at 45-51 Park Place, just over two blocks from the northern edge of the sprawling, 16-acre World Trade Center site. Its location is roughly half a dozen normal Lower Manhattan blocks from the site of the North Tower, the nearest of the two destroyed in the attacks.
The center's location, in a former Burlington Coat Factory store, is already used by the cleric for worship, drawing a spillover from the imam's former main place for prayers, the al-Farah mosque. That mosque, at 245 West Broadway, is about a dozen blocks north of the World Trade Center grounds.
Another, the Manhattan Mosque, stands five blocks from the northeast corner of the World Trade Center site.
To be sure, the center's association with 9/11 is intentional and its location is no geographic coincidence. The building was damaged in the Sept. 11 attacks and the center's planners say they want the center to stand as a statement against terrorism.
WHAT THEY SAID
--''There should be no mosque near ground zero in New York so long as there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia. ... America is experiencing an Islamist cultural-political offensive designed to undermine and destroy our civilization.'' -- Gingrich.
--''This religion's plan is to destroy our way of life. ... If we have to let them build it, make them build it nine stories underground, so we can walk above it as citizens and Christians.'' -- Ron McNeil, a House GOP candidate in the Florida Panhandle, in an exchange reported by The News Herald in Panama City.
THE FACTS:
Such opinions are shared by some Americans, while others are more reluctant to paint the religion with a broad brush and more welcoming of the faith in this country. Bush himself, while criticized at the time for stirring suspicions about American Muslims, traveled to a Washington mosque less than a week after the attacks to declare that terrorism is ''not what Islam is all about. Islam is peace.''
In any event, the U.S. armed forces field Muslim troops and make accommodations for them. The Pentagon opened an interfaith chapel in November 2002 close to the area where hijacked American Airlines flight 77 slammed into the building, killing 184 people.
Muslims gather there for a daily prayer service Monday through Thursday and hold a weekly worship service on Fridays, drawing no complaints. Similar but separate services are provided for other faiths.
Compiled and written by Associated Press writer Calvin Woodward; Tom Hays in New York and Anne Flaherty in Washington contributed to this report.
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11:09 AM
brutus smith says
dbd, kinda like black people apologizing for being slaves. Might make them more acceptable.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
08:07 PM
DBD says
Who is this Brutus Smith?He seems to be a self appointed arbitor of all political stands.Don't you understand that sensitivity issues are supposed to be the purview of liberals.The mosque,regardless of it's location ,is unpopular because emotions run high throughout that area.If muslims are truly concerned about acceptance a good first step would be to assuage public opinion be relocating.The other issues like funding and the Immams views can then be addressed in a more placid venue.
12:45 PM
DBD says
Is'nt great that we have all of these people that can interpret the remarks for us! Funny,but we did'nt use to need someone to tell us what we were reading.
12:29 PM
Sam says
brutie, why don't you join the fight, all talk, typical lib, you got nothing, nada, zilch.
11:17 AM
brutus smith says
If you tough guys are soooooooo concerned, Soldier of Fortune magazine! Join the fight over there.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
05:54 AM
Pete says
Bwahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
www.cleveland.com/darcy/index.ssf/2010/08/obamas_religion_editorial_cart.html
10:16 PM
iamrevolutionary says
That comment was to EZOB.BTW........
09:46 PM
Taxed Enough Already says
the Imam's wife says they are NOT building a mosque...it's a community center. If that is true then what's all the flap about "they constitutionally have the right to build a church or mosque there." Throws that theory right out the window now doesn't it?
09:45 PM
iamrevolutionary says
EXACTLY!!!! I was trying to say the same thing, on another thread.....But I am not as eloquent......
We will be DOOMED to RELIVE 9/11 .....NO ONE has learned ANYTHING!!
06:17 AM
Sam says
brutie & chuck lee, typical libs, they got nothing, nada, zilch.
03:06 PM
EZOB says
Many may be too young to appreciate fully the sacrifices of generations of servicemen on whose shoulders they stand. I forgive them for the untutored ways of youth and your naiveté. It may be that they are simply a sheep. There's no dishonor in being a sheep as long as you know & accept what you are.Then there are sheepdogs & I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock & confront the wolf. If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen a sheep. Sheep do not want to believe that there is evil in the world but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard & so they chose the path of denial.The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs & the capacity for violence. Still the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them were to stand at the ready in our airports in fatigues holding a M-16.The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs spray paint himself white & go "Baa." Until the wolf shows up.Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter checking the breeze barking at things that go bump in the night & yearning for a righteous battle.The old sheepdogs are a little older & wiser but they move to the sound of the guns when needed. Here is how the sheep & the sheepdog think differently.The sheep pretend the wolf will never come but the sheepdog lives for that day.There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog the warrior but he does have one real advantage. It is a conscious moral decision. If you want to be a sheep then you can be a sheep & that is okay but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes you & your loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If you want to be a wolf you can be one but the sheepdogs are going to hunt you down and you will never have rest safety trust or love. But if you want to be a sheepdog & walk the warrior's path then you must make a conscious & moral decision every day to dedicate equip & prepare yourself to thrive in that toxic corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door.We do not call for gifts or freedoms beyond our lot. We just need a small pat on the head a smile & a thank you to fill the emotional tank which is drained protecting the sheep. Be grateful for the thousands of American sheepdogs who permit you the freedom to express even bad ideas.
02:25 PM
Chung Lee says
Sam a lot can be said about a man and his dreams.
06:16 AM
Sam says
brutie & chuck lee, typical libs, they got nothing, nada, zilch.
09:56 AM
brutus smith says
Yeah we are all soft. Every one but you. You need to get a Soldier of Fortune magazine and become a mercenary. My BIL talks a lot like you, but he had the courage to go to Iraq as a "private contractor" and he is 61!
10:49 PM
Chung Lee says
Moderators have removed this comment because it contained obscenity. Discussion Guidelines07:31 PM
EZOB says
Moderators have removed this comment because it contained obscenity and personal attacks. Discussion Guidelines06:28 PM
Chung Lee says
Moderators have removed this comment because it contained libelous or defamatory statements. Discussion Guidelines05:57 PM
Taxed Enough Already says
Moderators have removed this comment because it contained obscenity. Discussion Guidelines02:41 PM
Sam says
70 days Repubs will have congress, dems have nothing, nada, zilch.
01:45 PM
brutus smith says
When you make accusations it is up to you to supply the proof. If it is just your opinion that is a different story. Supply unbiased proof of your conspiracy theory.
01:41 PM
brutus smith says
Who forced the committee to choose their design? Out of more than 1000 entries they just so happen to choose them? You tell me what she is, and an independent source saying it was proven they did this purposely. More right wing nuttery.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
12:53 PM
EZOB says
Just as I guessed, I was just waiting for your absurd Liberal "Left-Wing Extremist" reply. You failed to mention Milena's religion. Come on Brutus, Explain to everyone exactly what religion she practices. Again, only the parts of the story that they choose to disclose. Come on, I'll wait for your reply, I already know.
12:19 PM
brutus smith says
This is the architect of the Flight 93 sight. There is no mosque going up there. They won the design contest. I was asking the previous poster to provide the muslim connection. Research before you post.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
05:19 PM
6079 Smith W says
@ bs:
I couldn't care less if the architectural firm was owned by a Martian.
bs writes:
“They are currently working on the Bruggemeyer Library Expansion and Renovation for the City of Monterey Park, CA, etc.”
Every building you cite is a public facility undoubtedly funded with taxpayer money and you wonder why the middle class is going broke supporting the public sector?
Since not-for-profits pay little-to-no taxes, all taxpayers are subsidizing the building of this mosque.
Remember: One person's subsidy is another person's tax.
08:29 AM
brutus smith says
Paul Murdoch Architects is based in Los Angeles, California where Paul Murdoch founded the firm in 1991 after ten years of professional practice. Milena Murdoch joined the firm as Vice President in 2001 after sixteen years of professional experience as a project architect, manager and designer. The firm specializes in architecture, urban design and interiors for higher education, governmental, and residential building clients. Prior to the creation of the US Green Building Council, the firm established sustainable design guidelines for major projects such as the Staples Center Arena, and acted as an environmental design advisor to the City of Los Angeles.
Paul Murdoch has over twenty years of experience in the design and management of civic buildings, higher educational facilities, and custom residences. Paul became a registered architect in California in 1987, and is a member of the American Institute of Architects and a LEED Accredited Professional with the U.S. Green Building Council. Milena Murdoch became a registered architect in California in 1995, and, in previous associations, Milena was a project architect for the Harold Williams Auditorium at the Getty Center and project manager for the LAX Gateway Enhancements. Both Paul and Milena have also taught at UCLA and USC.
I failed to find the Muslim connection with the architects. Only right wing Republican Tom Tancredo, a known off the wall wingnut, coming up with these theories. Where was the Muslim connection on the selection committee?
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
They are currently working on the Bruggemeyer Library Expansion and Renovation for the City of Monterey Park, CA; the Ostrow Library and Chapel Expansion for the University of Judaism in Bel Air, CA; the Council District 9 Neighborhood City Hall for the City of Los Angeles and the Oxnard College Learning Resource Center in Oxnard, CA. Recent projects include the Plant Physiology Research Center for UCLA and the Van Nuys/Sherman Oaks Gymnasium for the City of Los Angeles, dedicated earlier this year.
11:01 PM
EZOB says
I just talked to Bill, they have come to an agrrement that it's now going to be "Bowl Shaped". The names of the 40 people will be on "Chimes" in a tower. Search--Shanksville, Pennsylvania crash site and you can read a lot of information. We are going to try and stop there next week-end.
10:40 PM
EZOB says
Check-out the Islamic Crescent that' at the Flight 93 crash site in Shanksville, Pa. It points to Mecca and contains 44 Monuments or markers. Yes 44, the number??? 40 Americans plus the 4 terrorists. Some friends of mine, mainly Bill Steiner--n3aj@zoominternet.net, was on the original dedication committee. When they found out it was to idolize the terrorist they tried to stop it. Well, it was a go anyway. Our local Musician, Steve Brownell, wrote a song and sang it there on the first anniversary was astonished to know what has taken place. Yep, look around, you won't have to travel all the way to New York to witness the negative Islamic impacts to the American way of life which is fast becoming the Muslim way of life. We have Detroit and a little closer is Toledo. By the way, the largest Jihad population is now Gahanna, Ohio right by Columbus. This is what I was told in Columbus.
10:34 AM
Sam says
brutie admits he's a crybaby," he called me a name, wahhhhhhh!" They have a constitutional right to have a mosque any where they like, but how about something you limp wristed libs don't seem to have, common sense and common decency. brutie, you got nothing, nada, zilch
10:06 AM
brutus smith says
sam, call me a left wingnut, Liberal, Progressive, leftist, whatever, and I won't go crying ohhhhhh, he called me a name, wahhhhhhh!
10:02 AM
brutus smith says
So sam, every time we have a new poll out we should change the Constitution? Should we remove the 100 other mosques in NYC? How about the 6 near ground zero? Should we remove Christian churches from Oklahoma city?
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
09:19 AM
Chung Lee says
Sam maybe because that same 70% don't understand the Constitution?
08:50 AM
Sam says
brutie, once again, no facts just far left wing, limp wristed rants. Seems like you libs are running away, now call yourselves "progressives". I am a proud right wing conservative. you got nothing, nada, zilch.
http://www.youtube.com/v/oMOZvbYJMvU?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param
They wonder why almost 70% of all Americans are against this mosque at this site.
08:31 AM
brutus smith says
Oh by the way, Allen Grayson walks the walk. He votes how he talks. He not like your right wing hypocrite Repub who says he is for small business and the middle class but votes for big business and the rich.
08:27 AM
brutus smith says
Aaaa sal, when your opinion is the exact opposite of mine, and you consider me to be a leftist guerilla, why wouldn't your opinion be right wing?
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
08:02 AM
brutus smith says
Why do you guys deny your membership in the right wing of the Republican party? Are you ashamed? Do you really think fear and intimidation work? I pointed out some legitimate things and instead of addressing them you ignore it. You guys have no answers, nothing.
And then we have cheer leader sam. Where did I change the subject sammie cheer leader? C'mon sammie put your ideas out there. You go to the RNC site and there plan, agenda, whatever you want to call it is to defeat Obama. That's it! Nothing on what they would do to right the ship they darn near sunk.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
07:37 AM
Salvatore says
Why does brutus think that Alan Grayson is such a great American? Grayson is one of the richest persons in congress worth over $31.12 million. Did Grayson make all this money from entitlements? The Leftist online guerrilla brutus will label anybody as a right wing nut who do not agree with him. I am an Independent and a moderate. Brutus will use Leftist propaganda as facts. Nice to see Chung Lee using good English instead of that racist and fake broken Oriental-English. I think that out of respect to those who died in 911, the Islamic center could be built elsewhere. It is the right thing to do. There is too much hatred against the Muslims already. Not every Muslim is a religious fanatic. Evil fanatics can be found in all religions, even among the so called Christians.
05:59 AM
Sam says
EZOB, don't go to the sub level of brutie, you are better than him, his type is best ignored, he's got nothing, nada, zilch.
http://www.youtube.com/v/VV-UsJk2reI?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param
05:58 AM
Sam says
The best brutie can do is change the subject, when he lacks facts he uses rants, he's got nothing, nada, zilch. Only 73 days to change.
http://www.youtube.com/v/VV-UsJk2reI?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param
11:36 PM
EZOB says
Brutus,
I'm not a right wing-nut. I'm tired of your name calling. Like you said it's time to man-up. You name the time and place and I promise you I'll show up alone and man-up. I really don't care if I'm not allowed to post anymore, I've had enough of your dumb A#@ insults, Man-up-BOYYYY!
10:17 PM
goofus says
How can a religion of so called peace be so invested in the devastation of a peaceful country.
03:42 PM
brutus smith says
Do you really believe this can be solved militarily? Yeah our military leaders are still using the same failed strategy we used in Viet Nam, if you cut off the head the rest will give up. How many #2's and 3's have we taken out from Al Quada? We were pretty much immune from attacks until the jet plane made it easier to travel. People in Europe have things happen all the time and it doesn't consume their lives like it does the right wingnuts here. We have more people killed on the highways than we have ever had from an attack. You right wingnuts need to quit being afraid of your own shadows. Man up. Stuff happens.
Oh since you know your history, the hijackers came from Saudi Arabia not Iran. And as far as Iran goes, maybe if our CIA didn't over throw their Democratically elected Gov and put in the Shah, you could say the hostage crisis would never have happened. And what do you think China and Russia would say if we nuked Iran? After all the technology your beloved Corporations gave them, do you really believe we are still the Big Dog on the block? China already proved they can knock out our military satellites.
You are right about one thing, terrorism will never go away. Been here since the beginning.
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
02:11 PM
EZOB says
I do know my history, especially when I was part of it.. We have advisors in over 115 countries and not to start wars. Kennedy got us full fledge into Vietnam. LBJ saw fit to proceed because his father-in law, Lady Bird's dad, owned Brown and Root which is now Kellogg's Brown and Root, "KBR" on the New York Stock Exchange. It is now part of Hlliburton, ring a bell yet??
Many feel that had we went after Iran 100% after the hostage crisis many of the happenings leading up to 911 would not have taken place. If you are familiar with military terminology, it's like probing the enemy lines to find their weak points. We have shown ourselves to be weak, at least in the enemies to the United States eyes, and they will step up the atrocities until we do something more on the local fronts. If you are up-to-date on the bulling tactics in the schools this is the same thing on a much larger scale. I'm sure hoping more people start realizing this isn't going to go away easy. These people are very determined and worse yet, many here are helping them. How many innocent Americans have to be blown up before you are willing to wake-up? Please answer, the latest guy with the knife, check-out his name?? What will it take--- 5 more episodes in the next year-3-4,000 more innocent lives??? Present day, put me in office and Iran would have 24 hours to release the 3 American kids or I'd bomb Tehran flatter than it is and the nuclear site oalong with it.
01:29 PM
Sam says
http://www.youtube.com/v/DO_JKWgGw6o?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param
brutie says, I got nothing, nada, zilch.
07:47 AM
dorothy gale says
I am torn on this issue. If this mosque-community center-"all are welcome" place DOES manage to get built I think it won't be long before it is destroyed through yet another act of violence. It is legally, Constitutionally permissible, and does sound like it COULD be a good thing and to disallow it would be un-American. However, common sense indicates that the wounds of 9-11-2001 have not yet healed for many Americans and the push by the Imam to git 'r done AND to break ground on Sept. 11th may seem like rubbing salt in the wound, or at least a slap in the face. I am not sure what is right in this situation and I can see it from both sides' point of view. But why push for ground-breaking on THAT DATE? Why use THAT piece of property? Can't that land be sold and another piece of property be bought, to be used for this project? You know, like out of respect? It just seems like the Imam is trying to create controversy by pushing so hard for his project and not considering other options. The outcome promises to be very interesting indeed.
07:34 AM
grapplermom says
“Building this structure on the edge of the battlefield created by radical Islamists is not a celebration of religious pluralism and mutual tolerance; it is a political statement of shocking arrogance and hypocrisy.” Newt Gringrich
10:16 PM
brutus smith says
Said the fight to make ends meet
Keeps a man upon his feet
Holding down his job
Trying to show he can't be bought
It takes every kind of people
To make what life's about
Every kind of people
To make the world go 'round
Someone's looking for a lead
In his duty to a King or creed
Protecting what he feels is right
Fights against wrong with his life
There's no profit in deceit
Honest men know that
Revenge do not taste sweet
Whether yellow, black or white
Each and every man's the same inside
It takes every kind of people
To make what life's about
Every kind of people
To make the world go 'round
You know that love's the only goal
That could bring a peace to any soul
Hey, and every man's the same
He wants the sunshine in his name
It takes every kind of people
To make what life's about
Every kind of people
To make the world go 'round
It takes every kind of people
To make what life's about
Every kind of people
To make the world go 'round..
Lyrics from Robert Palmer's Every kind of people.
05:35 PM
stormy says
Not sure what they're planning, but I'm looking forward to a balanced fed gov't.
Right-wing Congress, left-wing White House...perfect. Both sides will have to move toward the middle in order to govern, as they did after the shake-up in '94.
05:33 PM
brutus smith says
ezob, FDR was President when WWII began. Who did you think it was? Dwight D. Eisenhauer sent the 1st "advisors" to Viet Nam. Carter was Prez when the helicopters crashed. Reagan was Prez and Bush 1 was VP during the Lebanon barracks incident. Reagan-Bush were involved in Iran-Contra too. Typical right wingnut you are, can't even do your own research. Glennie, spoon feed me some misinformation. Waaah!
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
05:24 PM
brutus smith says
So stormy, what are the plans if the Repubs get Congress back? Destroy Social Security? Have witch hunt trials like they did with Clinton costing the taxpayers $100,000,000 for nothing? Go back to finish off the middle class? C'mon, let's hear the plans, oh that's right,
Repubs have nothing, nada, zilch.
04:25 PM
EZOB says
Let's see if I can recall a little history, this from a registered Democrat. Who was in office when we entered WW11?? Who got us into Vietnam, was it a Republican? Some people, myself being one, believe many of these Middle Eastern problems could have been avoided if proper action would have been initiated long before either Bush. Can any of you remember the lack of action after the Beruit Embassy and Barracks deaths?? Do you recall the helicopter and plane crash while trying to rescue the prisoners in Iran that was attributed to lack of training and less military funding?? I wonder who was resposible for this?
The "Chosen One" isn't a Muslim. Wow, there really isn't any hope for some people. Pror to the presidential election in Nov. 2008, the O'Bama family attended church every Sunday, You have to remember that. How many times have they been to church since he was elected?? Could somebody research this and give me an answer. I promise to change my Muslim opinion if I'm wrong.